Tightening Lock Nuts on Wheel Bearings

[Jim-ME]

There is a rule of thumb on tightening wheel bearing lock nuts that I can't seem to remember. I don't have a gauge as shown in the Green Bible. I do remember that you tighten the inner nut and then back it off a bit but can't remember how much. Help would be greatly appreciated.
Jim

[KevinNY]

Tighten inner nut to seat hub, then back off fully and retighten with just your greasy hands on the big socket.

[TeriAnn]

Tighten inner nut to seat hub, then back off fully and retighten with just your greasy hands on the big socket.

EEWWWW! Icky poo! And probably too tight. Wheel bearings prefer to be a little too lose than to being a little too tight.

Tighten the inner nut all the way tight to make sure everything is properly seated, then back off the inner nut 1-1/2 flats (max 2 flats). Install lock washer & outer nut then proceed per the manual.

Your wife or girlfriend would prefer it if you did this job with rubber gloves on.:thumb-up:

[jac04]

While it may be better for the home mechanic to set wheel bearing end play a little looser rather than tighter, you can pick up a dial indicator and a magnetic base for fairly cheap from the big on-line tool suppliers.
I tried the 'back off 1-2 flats' method, but it didn't result in the end play per the manual. Did it so long ago, I can't remember how close it was, but I think it was a little loose. I ended up setting the end play with a dial indicator as I have always done on my Rovers.

In case anyone is interested, here is a little tidbit of technical info; Roller element bearings actually prefer to be slightly preloaded to provide maximum service life. The problem is that it is very difficult to accurately set a bearing preload, and if preloaded too much the bearing will fail very rapidly. Also, dealing with differential thermal expansion of the assembly can get tricky. Therefore, the wheel bearings are set with end play. They are big bearings for the application so they don't need to take advantage of any benefit of being preloaded.

[LR Max]

I use the same setup that is used for Dana 60s. If memory serves:

Torque to 50 ft-lbs. Back off a 1/4 turn.

Put on lock washer. Second nut to 100 ft-lb.

Did that about 3 years ago. Works good and is easy.

[luckyjoe]

This is the best non-dial-indicator method I have used (taken from David Gomes 60k Service on the D90 Source (http://www.d-90.com/faq/60kservice/main.html)). It’s especially nice if you do not keep a dial indicator in your on-board tool kit.

*****
Clean the stub axle with spray parts or carb cleaner and give it a light coating of wheel bearing grease. Especially the areas where the seal lips contact the stub axle. Slide the hub home and follow it with the outer bearing, washer, and hub nut. The latest procedure from Land Rover says the correct method for pre-loading these bearings is to follow this procedure:
1 - tighten inner nut to 37 ft lb. while spinning the hub
2 - back off the inner nut without disturbing the hub
3 - tighten the inner nut to 7 ft lb.
4 - place the tab washer on the stub axle
(I like to bias the tab washer in the clockwise direction with a finger while I hand tighten the outer hub nut so the tightening action of the outer nut doesn't further tighten the inner nut)
5 - place the outer nut on the stub axle and tighten to 37 ft lb.
6 - bend tab washer to lock both nuts in place
Replacement of the remainder of the parts is basically the reverse of the removal procedure. Keep everything clean and give the drive flange surface a light coating of Hylomar where it meets the hub before tightening the drive flange bolts.
*****

Used it many times on Series and Coiler hubs - Thanks David!

[Jim-ME]

Is there a hub nut socket that will accept a torque wrench. Mine only has holes for using a bar. I'd prefer to use a torque wrench.
Jim

[LR Max]

Is there a hub nut socket that will accept a torque wrench. Mine only has holes for using a bar. I'd prefer to use a torque wrench.
Jim

I bought a 2 1/16" socket from northern tool. I use that. Cheap and beefy for our applications.

[I Leak Oil]

Jim, I've done it by feel on many vehicles over the years. Never used a torque wrench or a dial indicator. Never had an issue. Maybe not for everyone but it's what's worked for me.

[TeriAnn]

This is the best non-dial-indicator method I have used (taken from David Gomes 60k Service on the D90 Source (http://www.d-90.com/faq/60kservice/main.html)). It’s especially nice if you do not keep a dial indicator in your on-board tool kit.


Which is maybe what you do for Discovery hubs & bearings. The text you quoted was for a Discovery which as different wheel bearings than a Series.

If the inner nut is torqued down 7 lbs how to you get the needed amount of hub wobble that you are supposed to measure with a dial indicator? David's method not only eliminates all wobble but puts 7 lbs load on the axle bearings.

To make things worse hub nuts tend to fit loose in their stub axle threads. This means when you tighten the outer nut, it pushes the inner nut inward eliminating a little of that unloaded space at the bearings. It took me a little time to figure out why the hub wobble as right when the inner nut was tightened but too tight after the lock washer & outer nut were added. To compensate I added a little looseness in the inner nut which got taken up when the outer nut was tightened against the inner nut. I found if I just back the inner nut off 1-1/2 flats from tight then add the outer nut I get real close to the right spacing.

[jac04]

If the inner nut is torqued down 7 lbs how to you get the needed amount of hub wobble that you are supposed to measure with a dial indicator? David's method not only eliminates all wobble but puts 7 lbs load on the axle bearings.

Like the post says, the method is used for preloading the bearings on the Discovery. I agree that it is not necessarily applicable to the Series.

To get technical again, for the Discovery method posted the inner nut is torqued to 7 ft-lbs, not 7 lbs force. This does not apply 7 lbs load on the bearings. It applies much more axial preload, roughly 340 lbs.

[TJR]

I use the same setup that is used for Dana 60s. If memory serves:

Torque to 50 ft-lbs. Back off a 1/4 turn.

Put on lock washer. Second nut to 100 ft-lb.

Did that about 3 years ago. Works good and is easy.

That's exactly what I've always done and recently re-did on the LR rear axle.. It is the same Ford method used on my dana 44 front. Never ans issue.
Though you should torque to 50 ft-lbs while rocking the hub back and forth.

What I hate most are the bent tab lock washers.... UUUGH!

[TeriAnn]

After all these different methods put fourth I had to pullout volume 2 of the White bible.

The factory calls it setting up hub end float and not bearing preload.

Anyway the reason I pulled the manual was because I didn't remember any torque setting for the big hub nuts & wanted to check. I mean 100 lbft? 50 lbft?? What holds everything in place is the lockwasher smashed down on a flat of both nuts not a huge gob of torque. Anyway the manual does not give a torque spec for these nuts. It just says to tighten the outer nut. So I suspect that torque level is unimportant here.

BTW: The stub shaft securing nut is 10-15 lbft and the drive flange or free wheel hub mounting bolts are 28lbft. Wheel bearing end float is 0.004-0.006 in with both nuts secure & the washer in place but not yet bent down.

[luckyjoe]

The one part I felt is important with David Gomes method was this:
1 - tighten inner nut to 37 ft lb. while spinning the hub

The spinning (by hand mind you) really helps set the hub, and in my experience leads to getting end float right the first time.

[TeriAnn]

The one part I felt is important with David Gomes method was this:
1 - tighten inner nut to 37 ft lb. while spinning the hub

The spinning (by hand mind you) really helps set the hub, and in my experience leads to getting end float right the first time.

OK. I'm not sure why tightening the inner nut to set the wheel bearings needs an exact torque setting. I just put a socket on the nut with a ratchet wrench & tighten as much as is easily comfortable. Give the wheel a turn to verify that the bearings are properly set in the races, verify tightness, then back the nut off 1-1/2 flats (for aftermarket nuts & sometimes as much as 2 flats for genuine nuts).

I assumed that people new to this procedure were reading their manual and following the steps until they came to the part that said to set up a dial indicator. The manual says to spin the hub.

ALWAYS read and follow the manual step by step for any procedure that you do not know by heart. The Land Rover owner's manual does a very good job of stepping you through the procedures called out in the recommended maintenance schedule. The Factory workshop manual does a mostly very good job of stepping you through all the other operations. I recommend following the manual step by step if you want to do a proper job with best results. The only time to do a web search on how to do a procedure is when you don't quite understand how to do a step and are looking for a different explanation that is more clear to you.

For setting up hubs, the only place I have suggested straying from the manual is for people who do not have, and likely do not know how to properly use, a dial indicator. The method I use, Backing off 1-1/2 to 2 flats, came down to me from a professional Series Land Rover mechanic about 30 years ago and has served me well the many times I have R&R'ed the hubs over the decades. I'm just sharing what I was taught and have been successfully using. If you have a dial indicator and know how to use it, by all means use one & get the end float within spec. For those who do not have a dial indicator and don't know how to use one, I'm just suggesting a rule of thumb that decades of experience by multiple people have shown it to be close enough for high mileage use without failure.

Take it of leave it. Since it is not my truck it doesn't matter a whole lot to me.

[TJR]

OK. I'm not sure why tightening the inner nut to set the wheel bearings needs an exact torque setting. I just put a socket on the nut with a ratchet wrench & tighten as much as is easily comfortable. Give the wheel a turn to verify that the bearings are properly set in the races, verify tightness, then back the nut off 1-1/2 flats (for aftermarket nuts & sometimes as much as 2 flats for genuine nuts).

I assumed that people new to this procedure were reading their manual and following the steps until they came to the part that said to set up a dial indicator. The manual says to spin the hub.

ALWAYS read and follow the manual step by step for any procedure that you do not know by heart. The Land Rover owner's manual does a very good job of stepping you through the procedures called out in the recommended maintenance schedule. The Factory workshop manual does a mostly very good job of stepping you through all the other operations. I recommend following the manual step by step if you want to do a proper job with best results. The only time to do a web search on how to do a procedure is when you don't quite understand how to do a step and are looking for a different explanation that is more clear to you.

For setting up hubs, the only place I have suggested straying from the manual is for people who do not have, and likely do not know how to properly use, a dial indicator. The method I use, Backing off 1-1/2 to 2 flats, came down to me from a professional Series Land Rover mechanic about 30 years ago and has served me well the many times I have R&R'ed the hubs over the decades. I'm just sharing what I was taught and have been successfully using. If you have a dial indicator and know how to use it, by all means use one & get the end float within spec. For those who do not have a dial indicator and don't know how to use one, I'm just suggesting a rule of thumb that decades of experience by multiple people have shown it to be close enough for high mileage use without failure.

Take it of leave it. Since it is not my truck it doesn't matter a whole lot to me.


I think all of the above is solid advice.

The Dana 44 ford method I mentioned earlier is a pretty good method for me. Easy to do and has never let me down.

for what it's worth.. I just checked the Dana 44 wheel brg lock nuts against the LR ones. They are both 16 thread per inch. In fact the Dana 44 nuts screw right onto the LR spindle.. I never knew that.

Backing off two flats is 120 degrees, 90 dregees is 1-1/2 flat...
so what the difference in 30 degrees when 1 turn is .0625" = .0625 * 30/360 = apprx .0052"

I don't know about the 60 degree vs 55 though. In my opinion.. It would be nice to use the dana 44 style lock nuts and washer and loose the bent tab lock washer.

[bkreutz]

I've been following this thread and found it interesting. When I started as a mechanic at the local Land Rover dealership in 1967 the method one of the "old timers" taught me was tighten with a breaker bar (tight) then loosen, retighten by hand on the socket, then back off 1 flat and put the lock tab and outer nut on. I've used this same method over the years on various makes with the same full floating bearing setup. I've seen various tech instructions printed over the years on how to do it. The last place I worked before retiring was at a Lexus dealer, so just for grins, I followed their complicated method on a LX470 front end, checked the torque on the nut after retightening it to the specified torque, then redid it using the "old" method, and it came out to exactly the same torque. I had to laugh, seems like I was doing it correctly for 40 years. :D