block heater options for 2.6 engine

[Cutter]

Anyone with experience in the past know if the 2.25 block heater fits the 2.6 engine? I am guessing it will not, so I'm trying to determine what my options are. As of now my rover is outside and not in the garage because it won't start due to the 20º temp here today.

[gudjeon]

A magnetic heater that sticks to the oil pan works wonders as it warms up the oil and heat rises from the bottom up. I have seen these on old tractors and do not need to be a permanent fixture.:thumb-up:

[Cutter]

Yeah I think that is the plan, maybe an inline lower radiator hose heater as well or alternatively. just curios if there was a motor specific option.

[Cutter]

I tried again this AM to start Toad, I put a charger on the battery to give it a bit of help. No dice. So I'm probably going to have to buy the generic if I want to get the truck out of the way in my driveway, but before hand I crawled under and looked for the plug. Here is the side with the most plugs in it:

http://kaijustudios.com/cutter/plugarcticheater.jpg

A little research on UK forums last night shows that the threaded plug there is used for the Arctic heater according to this thread on forum.landrovernet.com (http://forum.landrovernet.com/showthread.php/184887-SIII-Block-Heater-Locating-Core-Plugs?highlight=block+heater), but someone there also states it was used for a block pre heater. As this port is found on the 2.25 engine as well, I was curious if anyone knows the size/thread count? No local auto stores here
carry the magnetic or radiator hose heaters so if I have to order something I'd rather get a screw in type.

[LaneRover]

You can definitely get the truck out of the drive if you have a cast iron frying pan and some charcoal.

Put the charcoal in the pan and light it. Let everything burn til there are only coals and no flames then slide under Rover's engine. Keep an eye on it but leave it for 10-15 minutes or so then start your truck. Works best if there isn't much wind.

If you have a paved drive I would put some wood under the pan.

Or leave a couple work lights with 100 watt incandescent bulbs on in the engine compartment and throw an old blanket over the hood covering the radiator too - this may take a bit longer.

[Cutter]

I think I shamed it into starting by putting it on facebook and here, I had to give a turn over a few times and let the battery recover. Still its a temporary solution...
Thanks for the tips though, if it was closer to lunch I might have done it and cooked something at the same time...

EDIT

some more digging and it appears to be 1" BSPT, so I'm not going to find any thread in heater at NAPA methinks

[Terrys]

Cutter, the plug you have circled is not where the block heater goes. It goes into one of the freeze plug holes, either side of the plug you circled.

[Cutter]

Ok, I knew those were freeze plugs from my reading, but was mentally focused on the threaded bit. So if I measure that diameter with some calipers I may be able to find one that matches I'm assuming. How does one remove that lovely plug with no discernible edges?

[printjunky]

Usually use a drift punch on one side to "turn" the plug, then pull it out with channel locks or something similar.

[Cutter]

Easy enough, I'll let things warm up before I pour coolant all over myself. Thanks all!

[xsbowes]

Phillips & Temro make block heaters for 4 & 6 cylinder rover engines. http://www.zerostart.com/coldStart/engine_block_heaters.asp

part no. 3100070 for 4 cylinder and 3100003 for 6 cylinder. only place on line I could find that had them was www.woodys-auto-supply.com. 2 in stock for the 6cylinder

[Terrys]

I've always used a long pointed punch. Put a hole slightly off center, and then from the furtherest distance, just used the punch to pry it out. Usually comes out without a fuss. 2.25 is a bit of a pain if the manifolds are on, but still can be done, Your 2.6 looks like you have tons of room.

[Cutter]

Hmm, Phillips & Temro lists a 1" bore, I didn't see anything other than the threaded plug that was close to 1"...

[bpj911]

The things leak and are a pain in the ass to deal with. I would just figure out why it won't start and fix it. They should easily start at 20 degrees. I have had some success in the past with the inline heaters but really a garage is easier. :)

[printjunky]

Let me chime in for lower rad hose heaters. I've had fine luck with block heaters, but better luck (including 4 years in North Dakota!) with rad hose heaters.

[xsbowes]

Hmm, Phillips & Temro lists a 1" bore, I didn't see anything other than the threaded plug that was close to 1"...

LRFAQ had the old temro part numbers but the 4 and 6 cylinders were different.

[Cutter]

I've got a garage, its not heated however. The rover was in the driveway and wouldn't start to return to its cave so it sat. I suppose the battery could be too weak and need replacing, but it is (supposedly) a 3 year old Optima the P.O. put in.

[I Leak Oil]

Ya, it should start in 20 degree weather no problem. There's something else wrong. A block heater will just address the symptom leaving the problem to bite you in the arse at the most inconvenient time. I'd start with the battery and connections, go from there

[Terrys]

No offense, but a block heater won't leak if care is taken when puting it in. Everyone has a story to tell, and everyone has a preference, and I'm no different. I have had a block heater in my 110 for 8 years. If it's leaking, then the rover fairey has been pi$$ing in my radiator, because I don't loose coolant. My '87 diesel merc wagon has the same block heater since new. Guess where it's installed.
When the thermostat is closed, you don't get much circulation, so my thinking is I'd rather put the heat into the engine, then into the rad. Any kind of breeze and the heat is nicely dissipated right out through the rad fins. Last dumb yankee thought is that it's the engine I'm trying to start, not the radiator.

[bpj911]

I don't know much about a lower radiator hose heater but one of the inline circulating heaters heats the entire engine by circulating hot coolant. I have had several of the freeze plug heaters and most were ok but the ones that weren't were a hassle. Notably, leaking. Not that it's a big deal to replace one but compared to just loosening some heater hoses I find it to be a hassle. At least here in Nebraska where it's warm all the time.

I use a Swingfire or Schwingfeur if it's super suck cold out and i can just carry it around to that gearboxes or wheel drives or whatever is frozen.

[Cutter]

I'll make everyone happy but my wife and start with the battery and then see about the block heater. I sort of follow Terrys's logic regarding the ideal placement, and like the cleanliness of that solution, though the simplicity of the lower hose inline heater is attractive.

[yorker]

It really should be starting in this weather- it isn't THAT cold out yet. I'd suspect your battery- get it tested, there was a while when Optimas seemed to go to hell left and right.

For engine heaters i always liked the ones that circulated the water, I have had a bunch of the Kat ones like this in the past:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/KATS-K200-TANK-TYPE-EXTERNAL-ENGINE-HEATER-2000-WATT-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem19c1a28b2dQQitemZ11062 2837549QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccesso ries

[bpj911]

I like those KAT heaters. I couldn't remember the brand name.

[Moose]

The original 2.25 engine in my Series 3 had that same threaded port. It was near the rear of the engine just past and above the rear freeze plug. It was a 1" thread I seem to remember. I was able to get a thread in heater at Canadian Tire, the big chain store up here in the Great White North. This was many many moons ago so I don't have a clue about the part number now. Was a Temro though.

After an engine swap, the "new" engine didn't have the threaded port :( so I went with the lower rad hose heater. The thing worked great and the truck would start easily at -30. The way you are supposed to install the inline heaters is above the bend in the lower rad hose, nearer the water pump. That way, the the majority of the heat rises up through the engine from the bottom.

I've got freeze plug installed heaters now in both my 88 and 110 diesels and neither of them leak. Both were installed while the engines were on the bench, so that may have had something to do with it... much easier that way.

Brett

[Dav1550]

Hmm, Phillips & Temro lists a 1" bore, I didn't see anything other than the threaded plug that was close to 1"...



FYI.....The 1” freeze plugs are on the left side of the motor there about the exhaust header.

[Cutter]

Really? On a 6 cylinder engine? I'll look again.

[Dav1550]

Really? On a 6 cylinder engine? I'll look again.



They’re pretty well hidden by the manifold, except for the one at the front of the motor…. You’ll find it just next to where the block serial # is stamped.
Dave
74 SIII 109 stationwagon 2.6 6/cyl

[Cutter]

There they are, thanks for pointing that out. I don't think that is a good location for a block heater due to the heat from the manifold-seems like it would shorten the lifespan significantly of any electrics and the rubber gasket. I also see on the Temco pdf of vehicles (2009_Zerostart_Application_Guide_and_Product_cata log.pdf (http://www.zerostart.com/UserFiles/File/2009_Zerostart_Application_Guide_and_Product_catal og.pdf) p.23)that the heater listed is threaded 1"- so I think it might be intended for that port on the side that I pointed out. I read that plug is near impossible to take out without destructive means.

[Donnie]

Anyone with experience in the past know if the 2.25 block heater fits the 2.6 engine? I am guessing it will not, so I'm trying to determine what my options are. As of now my rover is outside and not in the garage because it won't start due to the 20º temp here today.
Pushing in the clutch petal will help a SLIGHT bit as you are not churning the 90 weight oel in the gearbox. Not a BIG concern or solution to your problem, just a tid bit of info,,

[Roverowner]

http://www.wolverineheater.com/

I just put one of these on my diesel Dodge Sprinter yesterday. Never needed to put a heater on a gas engine before, even in really cold weather. As in -20F cold.

[junkyddog11]

Cutter, that battery is probably most of the problem.

Howzit running (once it starts)?

For what it's worth, I use radiator hose heaters in my heaps (and they are all diesel, and need help) as they are just as effective as the heaters you can fit in a Rover freeze plug and much less hassle to deal with. I have had to remove more leaking block mounted heaters, some that even short out the "shore power" over the years. Most were probably pretty old. I have had to remove hose mounted heaters for the same reason. It's pretty easy to carry a splice for a hose but it's a pain in the arse to repair the freeze plug.

The only thought I had in regard to the hose heaters is possible hose restriction leading to temp issues in summer but have yet to notice any issues with that

[Cutter]

Hi Matt,

Its running great, it really is a pretty decent powerplant for a rover, nothing fancy but smooth and adequately fast.
I am going to replace the battery and see how it goes from there. , Your comment on hose restriction does concern me a bit since this engine runs pretty hot in the summer. I'm a wimp and won't be driving a rover in -20f regularly, so if the engine should start down to 0, I should be fine. After a weekend of thought I'm going to buy a magnetic pan heater to start if after swapping the battery and checking connections it still protests.

[fruitpunch]

My Swiss 6Cyl after upgrading it with a Optima and getting the Carb rebuilt never had any low temp starting issues. Almost started better when it was cold then when it was warm.... what kind of oil are you running ?.....

[Cutter]

Pretty sure its 20W/40.