Eliminating oil cooler

[masonater]

During my rover knowledge hunt I have heard that the oil cooler is not necessary, especially when combined with the 8 blade fan. Im starting to put everything back together on my 109 and was thinking of skipping the oil cooler and associated lines. I know there is a fitting on the oil pan that i would have to plug somehow and i would also loose the oil temp function on my gage. Does anyone have thoughts on this?
thanks, Mason

[JimCT]

The best thing you can do for and engine is cool the oil, and the oil temp gauge tells you much more about the engine then the coolant temp. I would keep them both.

[SeriesShorty]

I'm totally with Jim on this one as well. The cooler the better even if it may seem overkill, and the oil temp gauge is a must have in my opinion. It's one of the few gauges that I am putting back in my new dash.

[JimCT]

An oil pressure gauge shows you when you have lost oil and it is probably already too late. As the oil get low, the temp goes up, the temp gauge gives you a much earlier warning of something amiss.

[Big_Mark]

The oil cooler is one of the great engineering features on a Land Rover you should keep it.

[LR Max]

The oil cooler is one of the great engineering features on a Land Rover you should keep it.

There are no "great engineering features" on a Series. However it is a great engineering marvel that these trucks can take so much abuse and keept going.

I'm meh on the oil cooler. Its a parallel line oil cooler and sometimes I wonder how much actually goes through it (unlike a LSx engine which shoots all the oil to an oil cooler). So, meh, I guess?

Anywho, if you wanted to get rid of the oil cooler then all you gotta do is unbolt it, unbolt the adapter place and install shorter bolts. Then plug the bolt in the oil pan. You can easily retain your oil temp sensor.

If you swapped out for a non-oil cooler pan, then yes you would loose the oil temp sensor.

[masonater]

From reading all of your posts, looks like im going to keep it. I do drive on the beach a lot so it makes sense to have the cooler installed. Plus it looks pretty cool behind the grill. I did hate the dying cat noise it would make a lot...maybe now since ive cleaned it all up it will go away. Thanks for all your input.

While we are on the subject, where would I get a new temp sensor? They seem to be hard to locate in the US...Ive seen a on on BP's site but its with a new gage.

[69Bugeye]

I'm totally with Jim on this one as well. The cooler the better even if it may seem overkill, and the oil temp gauge is a must have in my opinion. It's one of the few gauges that I am putting back in my new dash.

I'm going to have to repectfully disagree on this one.

While it is true that overheating the oil will have disasterous effects on the engine, the truth of the matter is that series petrol engines simply do not have an overheating problem. They are very robust in this regard. It is my understanding that the oil coolers were designed mainly for the military because they would often sit and idle for long periods using the engine to power various electrical and PTO driven devices. In this application, there was a need for additional cooling since there was little airflow over the engine.

Cooling the oil too much is almost as bad as overheating it. We want the oil to reach proper operation temperature so that it achieves its designed viscosity and therefore optimum lubricating, cooling and cleaning potential.

Another aspect of oil temperature is the need to boil off water. Especially for those in wet or humid climates, water is continually being introduced into the engine by way of the air it breaths. When we shut the engine down, this moisture condenses on the internal surfaces of the engine and then mixes with the oil. If we don't allow the engine oil to reach proper temperature this water never gets purged from the system, and therefore you may have corrosion isssues. Keep this in mind if you often start your car or motorcyle and drive less than 15 minutes to work and back each day. In this routine, you are probably not getting the oil up to temperature and may be shortening your engine life.

It is generally accepted that 180 to 200 degrees F is the proper range for internal combustion engine oil temps. Ideally, you should continue to run the engine for 30 minutes AFTER the oil reaches proper temperature in order to boil off the water and any contaminates that it may carry.

I do like the idea of having an oil temperature gauge as there is no such thing as too much information regarding the health of your engine. Unless you let the engine idle for hours on end or plan on living in Death Valley during the summer months, I think that the oil cooler is not neccessary.

Fully synthetic (Delvac-1, AMSOil, Redline,Motul) engine oil is the best thing you could ever do to your engine. Do a little online research on oil tests done by INDEPENDENT labs. First thing to learn is that just because the bottle says synthetic doesn't mean that it is. Most oils advertised as syn. are blended.

Sorry for the long reply. Ditch the oil cooler and study up on oil technology.
You and your engine will benefit. :thumb-up:

[mongoswede]

Most/some oil coolers have a thermostat that opens at a certain point to cool the oil. If you don't have one you could add one. That way you dont use it until you need it.

[Terrys]

While we are on the subject, where would I get a new temp sensor? They seem to be hard to locate in the US...Ive seen a on on BP's site but its with a new gage.
You can't have one without the other. It's a capillary tube gage, and assembled at the factory. Cut the tube and you're screwed.

[LR Max]

Speaking of which, while you've got it out, call up a radiator shop and see if they'll hot dip it.

I just had my radiator core hot dipped. HUGE performance increase for $25, 4 bolts and 15 minutes. Oil coolers don't work if they are full of crap (just like anything else).

[masonater]

69Bugeye, that is exactly what i heard and pretty much directly applies to my driving conditions, just add salt. I live on a tiny island and it is very common to not drive for longer that 10 or 15 minutes, and its always foggy and wet. You can do end to end in just over 15 in fact. There is the beach driving factor i am considering, in those conditions i have seen the engine get to its hottest, towing out jeeps and such.

In regards to synthetic oil, i was thinking about using it once it is all back together, in the jeep world i have been scared off from using it because i have close to 150K on my grand cherokee and worried about new leaks. I have low miles on the rover (45K) so im not quite as scared. So i guess i have some more thinking to do, but thank you for your informative reply.

Terry, I broke the capillary tube during disassembly, so any idea where i can source a new sensor complete with line?

LRMax, Im confident i got it pretty clean, i spent a while last winter on it, seems to run parts washer through no problem, but point taken. I have bead blasted it and it looks all nice and copper now, i even spent an hour or so straightening all the fins (OCD) My next thought was powder coating it, but i wonder if the powder coating on the fins will hurt the cooling function of it?

[Terrys]

Terry, I broke the capillary tube during disassembly, so any idea where i can source a new sensor complete with line?
It's an assembly. Tube and bulb are filled with fluid and soldered to the gage at the factory. It would be pointless to buy a new tube unless you have the specialized equipment to assemble it. You can have it repaired at Nissonger, but that will cost as much as a new gage/tube/bulb.

[yorker]

The best thing you can do for and engine is cool the oil, and the oil temp gauge tells you much more about the engine then the coolant temp. I would keep them both.


What oil temps are you running that indicate the need for an oil cooler? :confused:

The 2.25 is well cooled to begin with and has a large volume of oil, the oil coolers are really for long term stationary use in extreme heat- running the 2.25 12 hours at a time for the radios in an FFR for example. For a civilian Land Rover it is just one more liability, a source of leaks and potential catastrophic failure. Take it off and sell it on ebay. :thumb-up:

[masonater]

It's an assembly. Tube and bulb are filled with fluid and soldered to the gage at the factory. It would be pointless to buy a new tube unless you have the specialized equipment to assemble it. You can have it repaired at Nissonger, but that will cost as much as a new gage/tube/bulb.

Wow, not what i wanted to hear...
I have yet to dig into my gages, with my set up, the oil temp is one of the 3 that include fuel and water temp, in one of the 2 large gages, other being speedo. Are you saying either send it to a gage shop or get a whole new unit??

What specialized equipment would one need to repair it? There have been several airplanes built where im working, including older ones. Wondering if what you speak of is laying around somewhere?

[yorker]

Are you saying either send it to a gage shop or get a whole new unit??

What specialized equipment would one need to repair it? There have been several airplanes built where im working, including older ones. Wondering if what you speak of is laying around somewhere?


http://www.ply33.com/repair/tempgauge

[luckyjoe]

Cooling the oil too much is almost as bad as overheating it...

Another aspect of oil temperature is the need to boil off water...

These are the key concerns. I'd say most will never need it. I left the one on my exMoD 109 as original equipment. I'm toying with the idea of adapting the defender 2.5d spin-on filter adaptor and thermostatic cooler feed valve. I think this would be the ideal solution...

Tom P.

[bpj911]

Use good oil and turn your ipod up. I sure wish I had enough spare time to be concerned with such things.

[masonater]

http://www.ply33.com/repair/tempgauge


Nice! thanks, even though this is all a learning process id much rather try and fail vs. sending it off and paying someone.

[jimrr]

you could get another guage and tube, then get an adapter to fit in the well, (hole), I'd certainly keep the oil cooler if I had one but you would want to make sure your oil is getting to 115 F, which in school they tell us is nominal temp.

[jac04]

...you would want to make sure your oil is getting to 115 F, which in school they tell us is nominal temp.
115 F ? I'm not sure what you mean by nominal oil temp, but that's way too low for full operating temperature.

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j126/jac04/000_0704a.jpg

[Momo]

Masonater, keep your eye out on ebay for a Smiths dual oil/water temp gauge. These were used on a number of British cars of the period. I picked one up that had been on a Jag, works perfectly. Don't buy it unless the seller can prove that the water temp gauge works (ie photo of sensor immersed in boiling water with gauge displaying temp). I think I paid $60 which is a screaming deal.

[xsbowes]

http://www.gaugeguys.com/Smiths/classic.htm

All types of Smiths intruments.

[greenmeanie]

The correct temp gauges for the series multigauge with the capillary tube come up on ebay UK all the time from one of the big UK parts places and are a very reasonable price. I picked up a couple of spares for my 101 that are still kicking around on the shelf.

If you are playing around with ex mod stuff looking in the UK is the best way to go as there are quite a few places that specialize in that stuff.