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Crash
02-14-2011, 09:27 PM
In looking at part manuals it is apparent that some rear axles have a stub axle thatis an integral part and others a bolt on version is used. Mine are integral and are off a 1973 sIII.

It looks like some of the later stub axles did not come with a removable distance piece.

Is there any significant difference or does anyone know when the change was made?

C

Terrys
02-15-2011, 06:38 AM
In looking at part manuals it is apparent that some rear axles have a stub axle thatis an integral part and others a bolt on version is used. Mine are integral and are off a 1973 sIII.
Are you sure about that?

siii8873
02-15-2011, 09:17 AM
I know there are some after market axles that have integral drive flanges with the axles. Don't think original equipment did.

Terrys
02-15-2011, 09:29 AM
I got the impression he was talking about the stub axle, which bolts to the rear axle housing, not the axle shafts. I have also seen axle shafts with drive flanges attached, but never seen a stub axle as part of the casing. Axle casings are just a fabricattion of formed steel parts, but the stub axle is machined, and threaded. That would be pretty difficult to do as a one piece assembly.

I Leak Oil
02-15-2011, 11:19 AM
Never heard of it on a stock rover axle so....MUST...SEE...PICTURES!

masonater
02-15-2011, 01:01 PM
is that what your talking about? Its all one piece. mine is on a 70 EX-MOD 2a 109 no reason to think that is a aftermarket axel unless some troops swapped it out.

Terrys
02-15-2011, 02:33 PM
is that what your talking about? Its all one piece. mine is on a 70 EX-MOD 2a 109 no reason to think that is a aftermarket axel unless some troops swapped it out.
Yes, exactly. Do yourself a big favor and don't put your hubs on and put it back down on it's own weight, because that's when you'll find out what looks like one piece, isn't one piece. When they have been on gthere a long time, the rust in place, but you'll find that the rear stub axle has a recess machined in the back and fits over the ring on the casing. Put the nuts on and give it a good whack with a 2/4. Now it's two pieces. Amongst my many, I had a '70 2A Exmod also.

I Leak Oil
02-15-2011, 02:55 PM
is that what your talking about? Its all one piece. mine is on a 70 EX-MOD 2a 109 no reason to think that is a aftermarket axel unless some troops swapped it out.

No that's just a regular rear stub. See the bolt circle? That's where the stub bolt to the flange on the axle casing. On the rear, as you have pictured, the stub is the female and the flange on the case is the male side.

Mercedesrover
02-15-2011, 03:04 PM
...Do yourself a big favor and don't put your hubs on and put it back down on it's own weight, because that's when you'll find out what looks like one piece, isn't one piece....

What he said.

While you are right where you are now, knock it apart, clean up the flanges, reseal and put it back together. If you ever break one in the bush it will be easier to take apart.

Terrys
02-15-2011, 03:16 PM
If you ever break one in the bush it will be easier to take apart.
Yeah, like deep in the 'Sconset Rain Forest.

Mercedesrover
02-15-2011, 03:34 PM
You know me, Terry....My crap doesn't break until I'm 100 miles from nowhere.

masonater
02-15-2011, 07:00 PM
Yeah, like deep in the 'Sconset Rain Forest.

hahah awesome

thanks for the info i would have never thought to look anymore into these, so im clear are you saying put the hub nuts on then whack it?

ps sorry for the hijack

Terrys
02-16-2011, 05:13 AM
Yup, pretty much. You take your ball peen hammer and go around the back of the flange, tapping outward (not love taps, show it you're serious), but I'm usually less patient. I'd just put the nuts back on, wrap a rag around it, and take a 3' piece of 2x4 and give one good whack down, if necessary, one up, left and right. There will be a thin paper gasket between the casing and stub axle, and the rim on the back of the stub axle will need to be cleaned very well before going back on, as it's a tight fit.

Crash
02-16-2011, 08:26 PM
I will post pic's on Friday. I have two rear axles both with the stub axle apparently attached. I looked very closely and if they are separate pieces I will be very suprised. Just splitting the distance piece to remove it from the stub axle should have separated the pieces!

Till Friday!

Terrys
02-16-2011, 08:52 PM
You need to get the wire brush out and give the back side of the flange a good working over. You'll see the ring which is the mating joint of the stub axle that fits over the casing flange. That's not to say that someone didn't weld up the joint, which would make no sense. You loose one stub axle and are willing to throw the whole thing out? Go through any of the parts books, you won't find one supplied that way from the factory.

Crash
02-18-2011, 10:05 AM
Just getting the shop warmed up.

Is the rear stub axle similar to one for the front? Do they mount the same way? I realize they are two different part numbers but from the manual it looks like they bolt up the same way.

The mystery continues!

C

jac04
02-18-2011, 10:49 AM
The both mount in the same basic way - they are bolted in place. IIRC, the rears pilot on the OD of the axle case, while the fronts pilot on the ID of the swivel pin housing. Rears use through bolts with nuts and fronts are bolts threaded into the SPH.

Crash
02-18-2011, 11:33 AM
This is beginning to make sense. The rear stub axle has a flange that not only butts up to the axle flange but is "recessed" so that it fits over the OD of the axle flange.

The parts drawings don't really show that. I would have expected that in replacing the distance piece that the stub axle would have come loose!

Both of my sets of rear axles, one really rusted and one very clean looked initially that this was an integral part.

Thanks for helping to solve the mystery.

C

TJR
02-18-2011, 12:06 PM
This is beginning to make sense. The rear stub axle has a flange that not only butts up to the axle flange but is "recessed" so that it fits over the OD of the axle flange.

The parts drawings don't really show that. I would have expected that in replacing the distance piece that the stub axle would have come loose!

Both of my sets of rear axles, one really rusted and one very clean looked initially that this was an integral part.

Thanks for helping to solve the mystery.

C

I recently pulled the stub shafts off a rear axle and it went like this. After removing all the bolts, I tried breaking them loose w/a decent size rubber mallet and knocking on the spindle itself. I hit it several times pretty hard an no go. I then switched to using a larger steel hammer and a brass drift against the OD edge and they popped off quite easily.

The other part of your question is correct. They did switch to spindles (stub shafts) that do not have a replaceable distance piece. In my experience on a rear Salisbury, the bearing part numbers changed too. The inner and outer tapered roller bearings became the same size. The Parts books should show that. I believe the wheel actual hubs differed too as the bearing race bores were made the same inner and outer.

I'm not sure if that is what is referred to as a "rationalized" axle.

...Talbot

jac04
02-18-2011, 12:28 PM
^^Yes, that change took place with the rationalized axles (October 1980 according to the parts manual I'm looking at.). Same inner & outer bearings, integral oil seal wear sleeve, different oil seals & different hubs.
My Lightweight has rationalized axles and it was a PITA to find some of the parts. Ended up ordering parts from the UK.

Terrys
02-18-2011, 07:08 PM
So here's a dumb question. Why was it necessary to make the rear spindles with a female recess, and the front spindles with a male stub, to fit Inside the SBH? I understand the idea of a captured diameter to carry the load, so the bolts are only in tension, but can't see why it was necessary to make two different parts.
I did use a rear stub axle on the front in an emergency (100 miles to get home from VT and only one place near Killington had just a rear tub axle. Good thing they were grade 8 bolts, but I swore it was gonna snap before I got back to CT. It didn't. I recall I couldn't get the axle nut on so just unlocked the hubs

jac04
02-18-2011, 08:00 PM
^^Good question. I've also wondered why when the change was made to greased hubs, the front stub axles got oil seals to keep oil out of the hubs but the rears didn't.