Series rebuild for overland

[Ncrover725]

I am looking for a bit of advice from all you "grey beards" out there when it comes to rovers. A few months ago I purchase a 1971 109, drove it 1000 miles home, and has been my daily driver since. I am learning about her on a daily basis and all is going well. Here is where the question comes in...... In your opinion would it be feasible to drive her from the panhandle of Florida to Belize. In Belize I would do the Ruta Maya paddle race and then ship her back. I have no worries about the overland bit of planning and executing. I am looking at the reliability, availability of parts, and a little dose of reality from you all. I think it can be done with good preparation and a solid tool kit / parts kit. My wife thinks I am crazy and thinks we should save a bazillion more years for a defender or cruiser. The second part of this would be to increase reliability with the rover (2.25 petrol) what improvements would you guys make. I talked with the rover whisperer Tim Smith in Connecticut and got some ideas. The trip would be approximately 18 months from now so I have some time.

[Ncrover725]

I forgot to list some of my thoughts.
-24 spline axles
-pertronix ignition
-snorkel
-alternator upgrade from stock
-standard inspection and seal job on transmission, overdrive, transfer
I know this list is short but being the rover was designed to be a work truck it seems to be a natural with not to much needed to be upgraded.

[mearstrae]

Sounds like a pretty sound list. Stronger axles (check), more reliable ignition (check), better alternator (maybe, depends on how many extras you run), Snorkle (maybe, depends on how you're going to use the truck). Seals (check, these things always need seals...)

I have seen many GM one wire alternators adapted, amps depends on your use (I have a GM 100amp on mine; have extra lights, CB, and other things running, but it's overkill for me.) Snorkles are nice in dusty road conditions as it gets the intake up out of most of the dust, in water you'll likley waterlog the dizzy before the air intake.

[TeriAnn]

From what I can tell from that icon picture it looks like you have a 109 regular. A very good choice.

Here is my suggestions for a minimal set up for a long range trip:

Get a Salisbury rear axle assembly from a SIII 109 plus a SIII rear propshaft and new 'U' bolts. The Salisbury is a bolt on swap and will give you much stronger 24 spline rear axles and a much stronger diff.

Drain & flush your hydraulic systems and replace all the rubber, hoses & piston kits (use genuine LR parts for this). Refill with fresh Castrol LMA fluid of switch over to DOT 5 right after replacing rubber.

If you have a single front fuel tank, have a front fuel tank outrigger welded onto the left side, and install a second tank on the left side. I have a how-to web page covering that. (http://www.expeditionlandrover.info/LRFrontFuelTank.htm) Rovers Down South (http://www.roversdownsouth.com/) stocks the parts you will need for the external filler. The second tank will be the same as carrying two gerry cans down at frame level. If you do not have them, get fuel filler locks and maybe one for the bonnet.

Then basically I would go completely through the truck front to back and check parts for wear, tightness and proper adjustment. I'd change all the fluids in the truck and you should be good to go.

Except for the rear axles these trucks are very capable out of the box without modification. The trick is to drive one that is not worn out and has everything within spec and properly adjusted. So other than a rear Salisbury, you want to focus on the condition of the truck, one sub assembly at a time. And give yourself lots of time for those unexpected parts replacements. Chances are your U bolt nuts will be rusted on and you will need to replace the U bolts to assure a proper torque. They should be periodically retorqued and most people do not do it until they have a failure. If you don't have them yet buy the owners manual and the workshop manual. The owners manual takes you through the tuneup procedure step by step and it has the factory maintenance schedule for keeping the truck in good running condition.

If you want to convert to a GM alternator, I have a how-to web page for that too. (http://www.expeditionlandrover.info/Delco_Alternators.html)

The Pertronix is a good idea as the points manufactured today are generally substandard. However they do fail and can leave you stranded without engine spark. It would not hurt to buy 2 and keep one in your spares box.

Your spares box should include a spare fan belt, complete set of coolant hoses, fluids, a spare hydraulic rubber hose, cap, rotor, spark plug wires, coil, fuel filter (If you don't have one already, install one) rubber gasket for the glass cup on the fuel pump (the seals do not reseal after they harden by sitting in petrol) and a fuel pump rebuild kit. A credit card and the 800 numbers of a couple LR parts houses can usually fill in the rest.

I don't think you will need a snorkel unless you are planning to convoy extensively in a desert while on the trip.

You can add lots and lots of expedition and camper gear to a 109 regular for repeated long range traveling if you decide that is what you want to do. But for primarily one long distant trip I think a Salisbury (always a very good idea for a 109 no matter what) and bringing your truck into very good operational condition is mostly all you need. And of course a second fuel tank doubles your driving range and keeps a pair of gerry cans off your truck.

[Partsman]

TeriAnn, how hard of a switch-over is it to put in a Pertronix to replace the points? As this is an upgrade I was considering for my 1965 109 Pick-up. Oh and BTW I love your website.

[TeriAnn]

TeriAnn, how hard of a switch-over is it to put in a Pertronix to replace the points? As this is an upgrade I was considering for my 1965 109 Pick-up. Oh and BTW I love your website.

Others can tell you for sure. I've heard that it is a piece of cake, but I always ran points in my 2.25L engine and electronic ignition in my 5.0.

The TR3 has a duel point Mallory distributor.

[Sputnicker]

There was an excellent thread on this subject a while back. Lots of opinions and some great advice from those with much experience. I especially liked Terri Ann's and Ray Woods' contributions. Here's the link:

http://www.roversnorth.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10938

[JimCT]

Do not change things that prevent you from getting spares from a regular LR parts supplier. You do not want to be in the middle of nowhere and have to find a machine shop to custom produce some one off part. Keep it simple.

[SafeAirOne]

Do not change things that prevent you from getting spares from a regular LR parts supplier. You do not want to be in the middle of nowhere and have to find a machine shop to custom produce some one off part. Keep it simple.

Good advise, though there probably aren't too many LR parts suppliers in the Americas that'll have series parts other than here in the US and Canada, since it's been decades since Rovers were the world's dominant off-road vehicle. Toyotas are a different story though...

[jac04]

The Pertronix is a simple swap. I've done it on 3 Rovers. The only issue I had was that the aluminum mounting plate on one needed to be filed a little for clearance. Not a big deal. I have not had reliability issues over many years, but I only put about 1000-1500 miles on a Rover per year. As with most electronic bits, if the Pertronix fails it is usually 'infant mortality'. So, if you install it and it lasts a month, then it should last a good long time. It's always good to carry a spare, but I would make sure that the spare has some run time on it to be sure it is OK as a spare.

[lrdukdog]

Don't forget that Belize is part of the Empire ruled by HRH Elizabeth. There should be Land-Rover support down there. I would also think about adding a SW rear fuel tank, get the "special" one that is larger that the usual one that is sized for the rear PTO. Yes, do take two Petronix, easier to change out that going back to points, I think.
Plus X2 on Teri Ann's advise.
Jim Wolf

[Ncrover725]

I lived in Belize for about six months a few years back and did see a bunch of defenders and a few old worn out series trucks. As far as support there it was more defender based. My reasoning for thinking of going to petronix is you can purchase a replacement in far more shops than ones you can find points. I fried a set of points this summer on a trip and had to order replacements online because no one carried them. I ended up pulling out my back up set and prayed I had no more drama.

Working the extra fuel tanks is one of my next projects. I just walked in from a 24 hour family back country rover adventure to test out a few things. Jerry cans on the roof rack look cool but I think are a bad idea. Weight, spilled fuel, and the pain of going from the ground to the roof confirmed my theory.

The fold and tumble jeep seat in back for the kids worked great. I folded it up for the kids to sleep in while my wife and I had the tent.

I am looking for a sallisbury rear end. I will start trolling for one on all the usual sites. That swap should be pretty easy. An off road shop up the street just got a front and rear early range rover front and rear axle set complete. He is looking to off load them pretty cheap. That made me curious about a swap in order to get disc brakes up front. I need to look a bit more into that.

[Ncrover725]

Jac04:
I put over 2500 miles on the 109 since august. I am definitely testing a bunch of her components. I have heard exactly what you said about if it goes bad it will be in the first month. I plan on two sets. One spare and one in the truck.

[lrdukdog]

My 109 has three fuel tanks, it's on a 109 one tonne MOD frame that came with the two under seat tanks and I put my SW tank back in after modifying the rear X-member to support it. So, that's about 45/46 gallons of gas. Imagine the range you would have if it was diesel powered.
Jim

[Ncrover725]

Here are some pics en route to our 24 hour off road adventure this weekend. We wanted to hit Uwharrie this weekend but it never worked out. The people in the Food Lion parking lot all stopped and watched as I lashed down the cooler of food on top of the truck.

[tmckeon88]

Are you traveling with the whole family? That will certainly fill your truck to capacity with gear!

I did a trip down the whole length of the Pan-American highway from Alaska to Tierra del Fuego about 10 years ago in a pretty stock 88". Regular Rover axles, and I did ineed break one, in Peru. The spares kits that people have described in these replies are all good. I think as long as it's running well enough now, taking extra tune up stuff - points, plugs, cap, rotor, condensor, wires, maybe a coil, should be OK. I ran with jerry cans on my roof, although they weren't full most of the time, only when I knew it was going to be a long haul between stations. I was reluctant to put them on the front bumper or rear door because I worried that a minor fender bender could become a big fireball. They were a bit of a hassle to wrestle up there full. Spillage not a problem.

I carried one spare tire and never had so much as a slow leak in any wheel the whole time- miraculous, considering the Dalton Highway and other roads in central America. Looking back on it, a second spare might have been smart. I used BFG All-Terrain A/Ts which were great tires.

Do you have an overdrive? You will want one for that trip; I had a Fairey, which I drove to death. Now I have a Roverdrive which I like better, and their customer service is good.

As far as breakdowns and repairs go, we had our share of misfortunes but by and large people are willing to help you out, especially in an old truck like that. RN can get parts to you- they shipped things to us in Canada and elsewhere- and you can often find amazing mechanics in out of the way places. A Rover mechanic in Monte Verde, Costa Rica did a homespun repair on the big bolts securing my steering arm to one of my swivel pin housings that is still solidly in place today. So I would say, keep a list of phone numbers to call parts houses, but don't be afraid of taking the plunge.

I would advise caution in Mexico because it's more dangerous there now than it was in the past; steer clear of Mexico City perhaps because they have weird, subtle traffic laws that are ripe for abuse by traffic police.

I'm happy to answer other inquiries if you want to PM me -

tmckeon88@hotmail.com

Good luck!
Tom

[siiirhd88]

I did the Range Rover disc brake axle conversion to the wife's 109 several years ago and can supply information if that is how you want to go. It is not without problems.... Remember the early Range Rover axles use 10 spline axles and diffs, so you won't gain any strength using them. The later RR and Disco axles are 24 spline and are a bit stronger and availability might be better in a land of coilers.

Bob


Quote: An off road shop up the street just got a front and rear early range rover front and rear axle set complete. He is looking to off load them pretty cheap. That made me curious about a swap in order to get disc brakes up front. I need to look a bit more into that.[/QUOTE]