NOS vs Aftermarket

[Ncrover725]

Last night I had some front brake issues develop so this morning I looked into it and saw I had a bad wheel cylinder. Looking around for wheel cylinders it looks like NOS / OE costs double an aftermarket cylinder. My question is at what point are the NOS items not worth buying due to the seals or other parts being degraded over time? A twenty year old part never used still has twenty year old rubber. I do agree the quality may have initially been higher but are we losing quality at some point due to age?

[SafeAirOne]

To answer your 2 questions:

#1--Depends on lots of factors.

#2--Yes.


Shop at a place that sells quality parts and stands behind the parts they sell.

[Apis Mellifera]

I just bought a wheel cylinder last week and pondered a similar thing. I had three options: Genuine, aftermarket cast iron, and aftermarket aluminum. I generally don't buy Genuine parts because many times you are paying for the sticker on the bag the part came in. Though $10 more, I opted for for the cast iron (Lockheed) part. I wouldn't buy NOS rubber brake parts. Really, the only appeal of NOS parts is that they are the exact item originally fitted. Usually Genuine has this same quality/swank. Often "Proline" aka aftermarket is an acceptable compromise. I have found parts where only Genuine was acceptable - Red and Yellow knobs, for example, but I'm willing to gamble with "Proline" unless there is a known shortcoming.

[I Leak Oil]

I tried for a few years to make the aluminum ones work. They do....just not for very long for me. The water and mud get past the rubber boot and they start to leak or seize quite quickly. The iron ones, like genuine or Girling\Lucas, seem to be much more tolerant. I went back to Girling and haven't had to replace one in a few years now.

[westcoastkevin]

I just honed out all 4 of mine yesterday and painted them. The rubber parts are off the shelf anyway. Is yours workable?

[jac04]

As others have said, it is not wise to buy true NOS parts when is comes to anything that can degrade over time. Go with Genuine or OE for the brake hydraulics. I have tried cheap aftermarket in the past with nothing but troubles.

Now, if you have to have NOS parts because you are doing a "correct" restoration, then disassemble the cylinders and install new rubber internals.

[Ncrover725]

I would say the downed cylinder is workable. I have seen prices for the Delphi cast iron cylinders for $15.00 and have read great reviews on them. Would you advise to replace just the downed cylinder, one side,, or the whole front end? With my other rigs I tried to keep "balance" when I replaced an item. I have seen on the forums a bunch of cylinders going bad as a slightly common occurence. I would not want to keep replacing things I dont have to.

[Billy5]

I have just replaced my brake servo with a proline unit. Had zero problems with fit, or operation. The only downfall was the original nuts do not fit the mounting studs on the back. IMO, it should of come with new nuts that fit the product. Other that, perfect.

[TeriAnn]

I do not recall ever seeing a genuine LR, Gurling or Lockheed brake cylinder made out of iron. In these days of pattern copies there are a lot of pattern aftermarket brake cylinders that had molds made from an original part and bare the name that was molded onto the original.

Anyway, I have 2 comments:

1. I bought a set of iron wheel cylinders back around '79. In those days I had to do a water crossing about 2 feet deep between my house and the road for about 7 months out of the year. My brakes got progressively worse over a fairly short time until they hardly worked at all. What I found was that water had gotten past the dust seal and between the cast iron cylinder body and the piston. Pistons were rusting solid to the cylinder walls. I only had a single rear cylinder still working when I took things apart. Most of the others were rusted to the point where I could stomp on the brakes with drums & shoes removed and still not get any movement. I had an extreme use in my truck. But it just accelerated a process that goes on when a truck is exposed to moisture that can get past the dust seals.

I think rusting is a reason why the OEM cylinders are cast in an aluminum alloy

2. Break the cycle of cylinders going bad. When you have a set go bad, don't replace them. Send them out to be sleeved and put them back on. A sleeved cylinder will not go bad. You just replace the rubber and not the cylinder.

[Apis Mellifera]

I do not recall ever seeing a genuine LR, Gurling or Lockheed brake cylinder made out of iron.

Delphi Lockheed Automotive Ltd. makes them.
http://www.rovahfarm.com/images/243297d.jpg


As for replacing, since it's on the front, for $15, I'd do both sides. I don't think "cheap" and "aftermarket" are necessarily mutually inclusive. I also don't know that rusting wheel cylinder pistons would be more likely or more of a problem with a cast iron bores or dissimilar aluminum bores. Probably a compromised seal, holding water/mud against raw steel, would cause trouble regardless. I would bet the machinability of aluminum in manufacture influenced LR's choice of material too. Sleeving is a great idea and basically eliminates the cylinder as a consumable.

[Billy5]

You know, after reading this, I went out to my toolbox. My grandfather was one of the old time mechanics, and i got a bunch of his tools. One of which is a wheel cylinder honing kit. Well used I must say, so i guess they did a fair share of these back in the day.

[TeriAnn]

You know, after reading this, I went out to my toolbox. My grandfather was one of the old time mechanics, and i got a bunch of his tools. One of which is a wheel cylinder honing kit. Well used I must say, so i guess they did a fair share of these back in the day.

Gurling brake cylinders have their bores polished, not honed like most American cylinders. When I rebuild them I use a small polishing wheel and white rouge.

[Terrys]

You may get a polished surface TA, but that's a perfect way to get them out of round. If anything, other than a bore hone, use a lap. Any good set of honing stones, with kerosene, tapping fluid, or light oil with give a more than satisfactory finish. Anything better than a 320 finish is good

[jac04]

Not sure about wheel cylinder seals, but with lip type oil seals in a rotating application it is possible to have a shaft that has too fine of a finish. Too fine of a finish will not allow the lip of the seal to be lubricated well enough.

[Billy5]

Not to hyjack the thread..but. I think its absolutely fantastic that we are even talking about rebuilding things. Like they used to do. Growing up in a shop, I remember what a brake service was, a real oil change, etc. Great stuff! Thank you all.