Clutch questions

[nickhauck]

Hi, new to the forum, have owned a 69 S2a 88 for about a year now and just starting to run in to issues. The clutch used to make my leg sore driving it but in the last 100 miles it’s gotten super easy almost way too easy and I’m guessing the clutch is the issue? Any insight anyone can provide would be great.

Thanks!

Nick

[nickhauck]

Not sure I clarified, sorry, still figuring this forum out.... the pedal is super easy to push down. The clutch engages when it’s close to the floor. It still works but I’m worried I’m going to get stranded somewhere..... so if it’s the clutch that needs fixing just need some advice on where to get started. What it might be....Never worked on a clutch before.

Nick

[wrongway]

Have you checked your fluid level? Could be the master cylinder is leaking. Crawl underneath and look. I think its on the right side of the transmission.

[TimberPig]

Have you checked your fluid level? Could be the master cylinder is leaking. Crawl underneath and look. I think its on the right side of the transmission.

The master cylinder is on the bulkhead at the clutch tower, the slave cylinder is on the right side of transmission.

[roverp480]

Check that one of the pins (65) through the couplings sleeve (64) , that transmits the rotary motion to the release bearing hasn't partially broken . If I remember correctly if one end of the pin breaks off, the clutch pedal will feel different and engagement point will change as well . There are two pins at 90 degrees to each other ,one each end of the sleeve. The parts are relatively cheap but its fiddly to get at. The spring (68) was deleted on later models . Picture out of early S2A manual For info Clevis 53 is connected to the hydraulic slave cylinder .13512

[cedryck]

First check fluid level. Then look for any leaking, at master, and slave. There is an adjustment that is clearly explained in the Green Bibles. Also check to see that the pedal has the returns springs, they can come loose. The problem is most likely in the linkage, and an adjustment is necessary. Slave cylindar at transmission does have a bleed nipple and can be bled.

[nickhauck]

thank you so much for the insight! So happy to feel supported! I know nothing mechanical about my rover yet, so this may be the first project to figure out! Such a cool community that rovers have. The fluid idea makes a lot of sense as its been progressively getting worse and a lowering fluid level is a logical conclusion. I'll get under there this weekend and see if I can figure out what I'm looking at......how to check the level, how to fill it, etc.....

[wrongway]

First thing to do is buy a manual of some kind like Haynes.

[nickhauck]

ok, checked the reservoir and sure enough, its almost empty. So filled it up but still not getting any difference in the clutch pedal. Its like the first 80% of the pedal does nothing but the last 20% it engages just fine. Springs back just fine though. I got under the vehicle and couldn't see any broken pins. Clearly a leak though as everything has a light coat of oil on it. Not sure where its coming from but hoping to at least get the vehicle operational so I don't get stranded somewhere... so not sure where to go from here? Was going to clean it all up this weekend to see if I could spot the leak. Wondering where to bleed from if maybe thats what i need to do to recharge the system a bit?13515

[cedryck]

ok, checked the reservoir and sure enough, its almost empty. So filled it up but still not getting any difference in the clutch pedal. Its like the first 80% of the pedal does nothing but the last 20% it engages just fine. Springs back just fine though. I got under the vehicle and couldn't see any broken pins. Clearly a leak though as everything has a light coat of oil on it. Not sure where its coming from but hoping to at least get the vehicle operational so I don't get stranded somewhere... so not sure where to go from here? Was going to clean it all up this weekend to see if I could spot the leak. Wondering where to bleed from if maybe thats what i need to do to recharge the system a bit?13515
Fill and Bleed at slave.

[roverp480]

As already suggested get a shop manual, possibly Haynes or preferably the Rover one . Extract from Owner's manual ( handbook) on bleeding the clutch13524

[nickhauck]

well, I'm stumped on this one. I got in and cleaned everything up so it was like new to try and spot any leaks. unloaded about 3 cans of brake-clean and engine cleaner to freshen it up. Then I bled the clutch (thanks for the help on this one!) and it was a bit better, but still not great. So I checked any linkage underneath and it all looked ok from what I could tell. So now I'm thinking that the master or the slave one of the two is bad. the slave seems to connect ok on the last 20% of the pedal which makes me believe that air is still somehow in there, but I cleaned it, bled the line, ran it around about 50 miles, then looked for leaks and I can't spot any. The reservoir is still full. So i'm stumped. To make things worse, the gears used to connect but now they are "slipping" when I try and connect. So I'm thinking that maybe its something like a pressure plate or something like that actually on the clutch itself. Not sure if there is a way to test individual parts to see if they are working? My "system" has an issue but don't know how to troubleshoot at this point.

[wrongway]

Best way to check if your clutch is slipping is to drive uphill in 4th gear and step on the gas hard. If the revs shoot up but you dont accelerate then time for a new clutch disc and pressure plate. Bleeding clutches can be tricky sometimes. Best to have someone depress clutch then close bleed screw before releasing. Repeat as long as it takes to get a good pedal making sure to top up the reservoir.

[nickhauck]

ok, thank you for the tip! I will give it a try tomorrow! so my best guess is that I have multiple issues going on... I think I have a leak somewhere in the clutch hydraulic system AND also have the pressure plate / clutch issue.... the guy I bought the vehicle from did a bunch of work to get it cleaned up, but he did leave a bunch of original parts. The rear axles went out a few weeks ago on a trail ride, so guessing that this clutch is likely an original as well and in need of replacement. The slave and master cylinder however really perplex me because even after bleeding it I just can't seem to find any leaks. So not sure where my pressure is leaving the system. Wondering if there is a way to somehow check these components? Like a dye that you could add to the system that shows up under a blacklight maybe? Wondering if there are any good suggestions of ways to find the leak apart from replacing each component one by one.....

[wrongway]

Inside the slave and master there are rubber cup shaped seals that push the fluid. It is possible the fluid is leaking past those seals so no pressure is built. Same idea behind a brake wheel cylinder.

[jimrr]

it can bypass (go from hi pressure area to low pressure area) in the master cylinder and you may not notice it till it starts coming out of the rear of the master cylinder (inside down the fire wall) .... in which case you'll be adding fluid too. if it bypasses at the slave cylinder then both sides of the slave cylinder will fill with fluid with the obvious result.
if the wheel cylinders are leaking you'll eventually see it running out of the brake drum. ,
my guess is you either have a heck of a lot of air in there (which isn't too hard to acomplish) or you are bypassing pressure at the pressure differential points.

[nickhauck]

ok, so happy to get this problem resolved! so the fix was there was a bolt on the master cylinder that connects to the pedal that had worked its way loose almost to the point it was falling off. After fixing this and putting the master cynlinder back together, it seems like its back to new again! Turns out the clutch "slipping" wasn't really an issue at all and seemed "tight" again after the fix. Going to watch it closely to make sure nothing is leaking. Seems ok now, but there was fluid loss before, so I think there still might be a leak somewhere. But its driving like a tank again, so very happy. Thank you so much for everyone that contributed to helping out! Could not have done it without the community support!

very grateful,

Nick
13527

[jimrr]

in the future: since that resevour doesn't take much fluid you can run synthetic in it, it won't absorb moisture ........ at least use dot 4.
and when you bleed it make sure you're on level ground ..... as per prior: if the slave leaks, it goes inside the bell housing and you'll have to undo the drain plug for the bell housing to get it out. This is something we all need to do as you get water and all manner of krap in there. I just leave mine out as the rear main leaks and the xmission ........ and and and !!

[roverp480]

If its a 2a the clutch slave is totally on the outside of the bell housing, so should be easy to check if its leaking. The S3 has the slave projecting into the bell housing & any leak from the seal will run inside .