Whats a fair price and am I crazy?

[runabout]

Found a 1973 Series III in a barnyard in the country. Its got 30k miles, looks very complete and original. It has no rust that I can find, only a few small dents as to be expected. It has not been run in 12 years. Just sat collecting dust. Theres no batery, so I cant turn it over. Couldnt do any diagnostics to speak of because I did not have any tools.

Seats are shot, and some of the hoses are dry and look worn. Other than that its all there and clean and tight.

So, Im trying to figure out what its fair market value is. Any Ideas?

[Jim-ME]

My opinion is that if all you have to do is replace hoses and tires, change all the fluids, do a complete ture up, and buy a new battery to have a driveable Rover my guess is that you would get a bargin up to $5,000. There are folks that would pay more and that is solely your decision depending on how badly you have been bitten by the Rover bug.
Jim

[Mercedesrover]

my guess is that you would get a bargin up to $5,000.

$5000? Are you trying to sell this truck? :)

It better be a darn nice truck for that kind of money. When you say sitting in the barnyard, do you mean sitting in the barn or the yard? Stored inside for 12 years is one thing, stored outside is quite another.

Are you sure there's no rust? I noticed from your other post that you live near a ski hill so I'm asuming there's snow where you live. How familiar with Land Rovers are you? You do know that the body is aluminum, right? The firewall (bulkhead) radiator support (breakfast) and frame are all steel, and this is where you'll find rust. Look at the footwells and frame closely. If you live in an are that has snow (and salt on the roads) you're going to have rust. I promise you.

If the truck has been sitting for that long, plan on the transmission and differentials to have problems too. The portion of the gears that have been sitting above the level of oil are surely rusted from condensation from the hundreds of heating/cooling cycles they've been exposed to. After a while the film of oil that protects them from this runs off and the gears will rust. The gas tank will be rusty for the same reason, both above the level of sour gas thats in the tank as well as the bottom where it pools under the fuel.

That's just the start of it. There will be 1000 other things that are wrong with the truck after that length of neglect.

Sorry to burst your bubble but if this truck has been sitting outside in a cold and wet part of the world it's going to be far from a drivable truck with a new battery. If it's been properly stored inside in Arizona, maybe. If it's in the shape I think it is, take one of those zeros off the price.

Jim

[LH Drive]

My first and only 1972 Series 3 was no barnyard find but it had been sitting for a few years also. It had a solidframe, the bulkhead and driver footwell panel had rust and I could see the ground from the passenger side footwell panel. min.rust on the door frames,window frames, but the window channels had to be swept away on a dust pan from all the rust. It had a new Turner engine installed and was running like a champ before parked, the PO had passed away. I also thought I would just install a new battery, add fuel and drive away. so I offered $3,200 and the next day I hauled it away.
To my supprize every seal had swollen up and started to leak so the brake booster & master cylinder were gone along with the wheel cylinders. The clutch pedal was all the way to the floor so the slave cylinder was also rusted shut. The input/output t-case seals started leaking and soon the e-brake would not hold. The pressure plate had somehow rusted solid to the flywheel and the clutch would not disengage. Fuel pump and Zenith carb was shot and I got lucky my fuel tank that was stainless steel so I just had to drop it and clean the gunk off. Fuel sending unit rusted away along with the pick up pipe. The 5 new tires with 100% tread had dry rot and also had to be replaced. I know I've spent over $3,000 on parts and hundreds of hours in my garage. I'm still very happy with my Series Rover but maybe if I had spent $1,500 less when I bought it I would have a new paint job.


MercedesRover is right,,,,$500 would be all I would pay now that I know what work is to be done. Think of it this way,,,how much will you buy it for if all you want to do is move it to your property just to look at it everyday.

[yorker]

For something that has sat derelict for that long I wouldn't give much for. I've never paid more than $700 for a Land Rover. Usually I offer $500. Sure if it was rust free and all original it is worth more but around here derelict Rovers are not rust free... Get a good hammer and start pounding on the frame, rear crossmember, front frame horns, check the bulkhead- footwells, etc.

[runabout]

Wow, perfect. Thanks for the responses. I appreciate the different opinions although Im not sure what bubble you are talking about bursting Jim.

I have never owned a series rover. I have owned a 98 range 4.6 and a 02 Discovery. Im interested in a series rover because of its simplicity, and the fact that Im pretty sure that the car will cost about the same as the maintenance bill ran me on my other cars, and I have a thing for old stuff.

I live in California. The Rover lives in a field in the desert now, and will live in a garage in a ski town in the mountains serving as a now and then car that will be used when it really dumps, or in the summer when I want to camp etc, not a daily driver, but my fun car. Out here we dont salt our roads, we use these things called snowplows, and we dont get the ice yall get up there in the north pole so salt is not required.

This rover lived in the desert and was used by a surveyor in a mining industry. All the areas you mentioned in your post were included in the copy of the "What to look for when buying a rover" section of the Rover FAQ site. I brought a printed copy of it out there when I had a look at this beast, believe me, the everlooming thought that a Great Basin rattle snake was going to crawl in mah boot while I lay under and around the rig w/ my trusty hammer was keeping me focused. So, all said, Im gonna stick with my answer and say I could not find any rust in my inspection. Paint is great too.

I didnt have my tools or an environment that was conducive to exporing gear boxes or internals, so thats a question mark. I dont understand why the gears would rust apart from sitting. I restored a 1975 VW westfalia, and it had sat for years too. I did have to drop the tank and clean and POR15 it, but the gears and internals were fine. I used liberal amounts of marvel mystery oil, and a few good fluid flushings and tuned her up all was well. I did do new heads just to feel confident on long trips. I camped all over the west in that thing, darn good rig. I have revived an old perkins diesel using that same method, in the salt water. Would you change your opininion on the state of the trans and diffs if the Rover sat out in the desert Jim?

So, lets say there needs to be the kind of work that LH Rover describes, what is that gonna add up to? I think that a purchase price of $500 is wishful thinking. The way I see it, I could get a runner for not much more than the $5K right? So how does one decide weather to take on one of these or not? I kinda like this one, but I am not an owner yet, Im really interested in obtaining a clean little series rover and want to set a realistical budget. So all help is appreciated.

I have also uploaded a picture of the Rover Im considering.

[LaneRover]

About 2 1/2 years ago I paid $5K for a Rover in Maine. It had sat for a bit, the body was all dinged up but it started up AND it already sat on a galvanized frame, had a front winch and a roof rack. I probably put another grand and many hours into it as I had to replace all the brake shoes, a couple of wheel cylinders, tune up, headlights, bulbs and so on. I should have replaced all the brake drums too but didn't have the cash at the time.

If the Rover in question doesn't have rust and you could start it and drive it then I would think about maybe paying the 5K. But as you can't drive it, start it or anything like that I would pay much less. There are potentially A LOT of problems that will rear their ugly heads since it has sat. If it is all complete and truly looks to be in good condition I would consider around 2000-2500. The big kick is not being able to drive it at all.

Brent

[LH Drive]

I still think the $500 tag on one from the rust belt that has sat for a few years is a reasonable offer.. I too would drop 2,000- 2,500 for one with a body that I would not have to replace any steel frames or mess with the bulkhead or swap out a frame. What does a rust free bulkhead go for anyway? I know its hard to offer someone change for something that they think is worth gold. I dont have $5,000 laying arround and to some $500 may seem like $5,000. I would print out some classified adds and show these when I make the offer. Some of us are sales guys and I know I'm not one. I sold my 1980 Diesel Scout for $2,400 after dumping $6,000 into it and I paid $2,500 for it.
If the tranny is not in gear you should be able to turn the engine by hand with the starting hand crank thats laying behind the seat. It should be there if the LR has 30,000 original miles.

[BackInA88]

Don't bet on a good drivetrain.
I bought a Series III trans from a guy in New Mexico (dustykowboy) and he said the trans was "perfect" it was a mess.
All the gears above the oil level were rusted BAD!

At least put the trans in netrual and jack up one wheel and turn the drive shaft by hand, and make sure it will shift through the gears on both the trans and t-case.


Steve

[runabout]

I see. Ouch. Bummer. You all think I will spend $3K to $5K putting this in reliable driver status? Oh, also I called the owner and said he wants $4K, no less. I was thinking I would have to spend $6K to $10K on one that is in a condition I would appreciate. Can I break even on this? I like the idea of knowing that I performed or hired all the work out and verified it. But it is gonna cost me. Im losing my excitement here by the hour.

[LH Drive]

If $4,000 are burning a hole in your pocket then I'd say go ahead and buy it. After parked for 12 years and no verification to why it was parked I would also expect major engine or drivetrain problems to come with it. I've always heard, "It ran fine before we parked it" If it ran fine ,would'nt they still be driving it? Don't be a sucker to this. If they really want 4k for it then offer them another grand and tell them you expect to drive it home.
They also wanted 4K for my series 3 in the condition I described. Before the owner passed away he was asking 15K for it and it was not even worth 5. Thats why it did'nt sell for the last 3 years before he died. If I had not paid close to the premium price they wanted it would still be parked till it would only be worth the price of scrap metal. I would take some more pictures and walk away. Buy one in good running shape and 10 years from now you will have a good parts rig waiting for you parked in the same place you last saw it.

[ctrover]

I paid 1200 for mine and it runs and drives great.There are plently of deals out there if you search the online classifieds real hard such as craigslist.If you cant get it to run or drive around in the yard your asking for trouble.Id say its worth about 750 for the parts,but why bother?.If your wiling to spend $4000 there are a bunch on craigslist in that price range in better shape that you can hop in and drive away.

[scott]

i paid 5800 for mine. it had new paint (even on the freak'n galvanized trim) and it was running. badvibes and i (jack coudn't make it) drove it 700+ miles home. everything that i've had to repace so far has been due to my really using it. jeff wil tell you i'm stupid in the dirt. but a desert find, 12 years sitting, 500 to 700 woud be all i'd go.

[LH Drive]

I'm sorry about all the flame,,,It's not aimed at you. It upsets me when someone has a classic car parked for 20+ yrs outside under a tree in great shape and they are waiting for some rich guy to drop a ton of cash for it. Instead the car just sits till the weather takes a toll on it. They should relocate the car to a storage and take care of it if it's worth that much....
Most can tell you what not to pay for it so that in the end you don't drop 100K on a car that will only be worth 10K. and I don't know where you can pick one up for 500 bucks in the condition you described.

[yorker]

Even if it IS a rust free desert find I'd be really wary because of the 12 years of no usage. That just screams WHY?! 30,000 miles usually isn't too much usage but if it was used at a mine or by a surveying crew it could actually be a lot of hours. Plus I personally don't put any faith in odometer readings on these trucks- it isn't like it is difficult to change speedos or tamper with readings. You need to look at other things to determine the real usage the truck has withstood. 4k might not be too bad if this truck was someone's daily driver and rust free like you describe but for a derelict it still seems too much.

[scott]

i agree on the "no faith in odo readings". mine said 96000 and i assumed it was 196000 or even 296000.

[Jim-ME]

I paid $5K for mine and drove it 300+ mi. home. It sat on a galvanized frame, had 4 brand new tires and had a brand new parabolic suspension. Since it arrived in the driveway I have replaced the front bumper, the entire rear end, both drive shafts, rear brake shoes and drums, all 4 wheel cylinders, rear brake lines, all the brake flex lines, the speedo and cable, the canvas top, the distributor, the coil, the seats, the door bottoms and tops, the breakfast, the radiator and hoses, the mud shields just to name what I can remember off the top of my head. Do I ever expect to recoup what I have spent? NO!!!! I simply have always loved Series Rovers and still have a lot of stuff left that I want to do. Do I feel that I over paid? No, for I knew what I was getting into and I know how fussy I am. FWIW I will be replacing the rear tub, the bulkhead, both front fenders, adding a diesel engine, plus paint for all the body parts. For you see, Rovers get in your blood and except for a very few owners always stays there. Go ahead and pay the asking price if that is what you want to do but be prepared for what possibly lies ahead. It's a sickness and a blessing. At 52 years of age I have not regrets and feel it has been a blessing to have my Rover.
Jim E.

[xrover]

A fair price for a series rover??? I am of the opinion that it is something that you put a personal dollar figure on. :)

I am not saying that it is not worth what it's worth but, we dont buy these things from a strictly utilitarian position.

It sounds to me like you were not out looking for any deals on a series land rover, it just happened to be there.

I have this rule of thumb, Offer what you think would be a deal on it. Based on what you have said anywhere from 1000.00 to 1500.00 would be good. After that, if the seller is not willing to move from the 4000.00 mark, figure what you would want to spend maximum, and, if it fits into that then buy it. You can expect to spend anywhere from 200.00 to 4000.00 fixing one of these things depending on what you consider drivable. More if you use the ECR aproach to rebuilding one of these.

I spent 6500.00 on a 73 series III with 89999???????? miles that had a new galvanized frame, 2 engines, hard and soft top, uninstalled fairey OD, 15 boxes of spare parts, and a hydraulic plow set up. (the list goes on). I have spent 400.00 more on additional parts, aprox. 50 hours of quality time, and I cant even count how much more I have spent on beer while working on it but, I wanted it so I bought it.

It is currently sitting in my driveway registered, insured, and inspected. I drive it about 200 miles per week. People think I'm crazy...:D

GOOD LUCK AND WELCOME TO OUR NIGHTMARE!!!

[scott]

the wife thinks mine's a money pit, so what. my 16 y/o asked me once as she past me in the driveway where i was elbow deep in grease from a fairey hub refurbishing, "doesn't it get frustrating always have to work on that thing?" i turned, smiled and said "no dear, this is what i do to relax after getting frustrated with raising a teenager"

[badvibes]

runabout-

Wow, tough call. But for $4000 I think I'd look around some more. Is this the truck you have to have? Remember these things are money pits. I bought mine for $500, fairly complete, not running. Needed a motor right off. All the mechanicals had to be gone thru. Then you start on the things you want, new/nicer seats etc etc. It doesn't end. Mine's my daily driver currently. If you're going to drive it be ready to work on it. Frequently. Last thing is I'd be sure to pre-lube the motor before you try to fire it up. Just my 2 cents worth. I'm sure that's an over-valuation. (is that even a real word?) Bottom line is it's your choice to make. A lot of people look at me like I'm a loon for driving a 43 year old truck.

Jeff

[runabout]

Wow, this board is awesome. you guys are enthusiastic and active. I appreciate all the replies. I have decided to pass on rolling the dice with this one, but I have learned a ton in the process. Thanks for all the opinions. I will find the right one, but Im going to take my time. Thanks again.

[PH4]

Series Rovers and Boats are very similar in it is usually much easier and cost effective to purchase one at a decent price that has been refurbished by the previous owner. A little more $$ on the front end will most likely be cheaper in the long run. I have two Series and both are in good overall condition but they do require to be maintained. Not surprising as one is 45 year old and the other 35.

[xrover]

Good luck finding the one thats right for you. If you find another one that you think would work for you look for rust everywhere first. The ones that have had no servicing tend to have the original frame. Spend a little extra to get one where the galvanized chassis and the bulkhead (firewall area) have been done. The rest of the Rover is not rediculous to purchase and can be serviced with a Haynes book and by referencing the GREEN BIBLE. But thats for another thread.:eek:

As far as for everything else. Part of the nostalgia of being the owner of one of these things is the original look. It drives the women crazy. (at least the ones your married too.....:D :D )

I have seen some that have perfect paint, met more who say they're planning on painting it soon, but the majority drive them the way they are. It's a Rover thing...:thumb-up:

Last but not least, dont spend up to your last dime to buy one because, you will need some cash weekly/monthly to keep it going.

If you really want to see some of these up close, go to Don Fryes event this month on the 22nd and 23rd if your anywhere near MA.