Axle/Hub/Brake Leaks

[fkerekes]

I just purchased a 1973 ex-MOD Series III 109,

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2182/2415823001_29227d42a4.jpg?v=0

and my first order of business is the brakes. Upon inspection, one of the front wheel cylinders is leaking:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2377/2415835715_c75833e4d3.jpg?v=0
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2327/2416640946_764467e880.jpg?v=0

I don't have any pictures with the wheel and drum off, but I visually verified the wheel cylinder leak. However I noticed more leaks that I'd like to attend to while I pull out and rebuild the wheel cylinder. I'd initially assumed this one was a hub seal, and since I've been hearing some grinding, I purchased new bearings, race, and seal for both wheels on the front axle. But this one makes me think I need to pull off the swivel housing and order more parts if I wanna take care of the front axle in one shot:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2309/2416654448_b0b30fbb0e.jpg?v=0

Then there's this guy:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2350/2416657790_7e64dae1ab.jpg?v=0

Can anyone comment? I have no experience with this vehicle prior to my brake inspection, and my garage space is limited, so I just want to try to get as much bang for buck when I do get a chance to monopolize the garage (briefly, or I get in trouble :)).

Thanks,

Franz

[greenmeanie]

That evidence points to an axle overhaul. New seals and bearings throughout and it'll feel a whole lot better. Whilst you've got it apart check the splines on the axles and the condition of the drive flange splines as these are often forgotten wear items.

I generally find that going through a subassembly such as an axle as a unit is more time and cost effective when compared to chasing individual leaks. That way you are not redoing work to get at the next problem. It's all pretty simple wrenching. A couple of bits of advice that will save you some hassle:
1. I'll probably cause controversy with this but I tend not to bother with paper gaskets and just use 'Right Stuff' instead. Works a charm as long as you are religious about getting the sealing surfaces clean.
2. If they are rusted, the fancy BSF bolts holding the chrome swivel to the axle tube can be replaced with standard 3/8-24UNF bolts. Just make sure they have the same length of unthreaded shank as the originals and you'll be good.

Once you have overhauled the axle you can come back and we'll start the traditional grease vs EP90 debate for swivel lubrication.

Cheers
Gregor

[Alaska Mike]

I agree with the point about completely going through the axle instead of doing it bit by bit.

While you're there, upgrade the breathers to the remote style. If they're the remote style, they're probably clogged. That's probably the cause of a couple of the leaks. Pressure builds up, and it looks for the easiest way out.

[fkerekes]

That evidence points to an axle overhaul. New seals and bearings throughout and it'll feel a whole lot better. Whilst you've got it apart check the splines on the axles and the condition of the drive flange splines as these are often forgotten wear items.

I generally find that going through a subassembly such as an axle as a unit is more time and cost effective when compared to chasing individual leaks. That way you are not redoing work to get at the next problem. It's all pretty simple wrenching. A couple of bits of advice that will save you some hassle:
1. I'll probably cause controversy with this but I tend not to bother with paper gaskets and just use 'Right Stuff' instead. Works a charm as long as you are religious about getting the sealing surfaces clean.
2. If they are rusted, the fancy BSF bolts holding the chrome swivel to the axle tube can be replaced with standard 3/8-24UNF bolts. Just make sure they have the same length of unthreaded shank as the originals and you'll be good.

Once you have overhauled the axle you can come back and we'll start the traditional grease vs EP90 debate for swivel lubrication.

Cheers
Gregor

Thanks for the info. I was hoping someone would say that and help me get rid of this half-ass piecemeal approach I've been clinging to in my head. Is there a comprehensive list of all the parts I'll need for a full axle overhaul out there somewhere? Basically I'm wondering to what extent I should go. The swivel assembly? The transfer case side of the diff (Salisbury, I believe), like the inner/outer pinion bearings? Shims?

I want to be as thorough as possible, but my experience is limited as far as drivetrains are concerned, and my garage is even more limited. So forgive me if I'm to asking questions whose answers should be obvious.

Cheers,
Franz

[Eric W S]

Thanks for the info. I was hoping someone would say that and help me get rid of this half-ass piecemeal approach I've been clinging to in my head. Is there a comprehensive list of all the parts I'll need for a full axle overhaul out there somewhere? Basically I'm wondering to what extent I should go. The swivel assembly? The transfer case side of the diff (Salisbury, I believe), like the inner/outer pinion bearings? Shims?

I want to be as thorough as possible, but my experience is limited as far as drivetrains are concerned, and my garage is even more limited. So forgive me if I'm to asking questions whose answers should be obvious.

Cheers,
Franz

Most suppliers, including our hosts, have swivel ball rebuild kits and will know what bearings to supply as well. I would get new axles and inspect the differential and front propshaft as well.

You can also look at the RN catalog by vehicle type. They have exploded parts view as well.

[Willard]

First order of business would be to pick up a Green Bible (http://roversnorth.com/store/p-2565-workshop-manual-serier-iii.aspx) (series manual, get the on for the series III) from there you can read up on what is required to rebuild the axle. They are not that bad to do.
The front axle would be a standard series axle, the rear should be a Salisbury, you can tell simply as it will not be the typical round axle housing but look more like a Dana 60.

Is your Exmod 24 volt?

[BackInA88]

2. If they are rusted, the fancy BSF bolts holding the chrome swivel to the axle tube can be replaced with standard 3/8-24UNF bolts. Just make sure they have the same length of unthreaded shank as the originals and you'll be good.

Standard?
These are grade 8 bolts aren't they?


Steve

[fkerekes]

The front axle would be a standard series axle, the rear should be a Salisbury, you can tell simply as it will not be the typical round axle housing but look more like a Dana 60.

So this is a standard rover axle:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2087/2416641344_b952da2c90.jpg?v=0
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3119/2416653422_66e978b3f3.jpg?v=0

and this is a Salisbury?

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2210/2416652086_0491e8c6e3.jpg?v=0



Is your Exmod 24 volt?
It's been converted to 12 volt somewhere along the way.

Thanks,
Franz

[greenmeanie]

Thanks for the info. I was hoping someone would say that and help me get rid of this half-ass piecemeal approach I've been clinging to in my head. Is there a comprehensive list of all the parts I'll need for a full axle overhaul out there somewhere? Basically I'm wondering to what extent I should go. The swivel assembly? The transfer case side of the diff (Salisbury, I believe), like the inner/outer pinion bearings? Shims?

I want to be as thorough as possible, but my experience is limited as far as drivetrains are concerned, and my garage is even more limited. So forgive me if I'm to asking questions whose answers should be obvious.

Cheers,
Franz

As someone said earlier the maual is your friend. I got one with my first truck and occasionally I even read it BEFORE starting. Usually I wait until I am at east dripping some blood.

For buying parts for a subsystem such as this the telephone is your friend. Phone our hosts and tell them you want all the parts for an axle overhaul. It's a lot easier to talk to an expert than try to figure out a kit for yourself - I always forget some niggly little essential bit. There are also some very nice upgrade bits for axles but I'll let others describe them.

I'd look at your swivels. The dark area on the surface swept by the seal looks like it is corroded. Take a rag and clean it to see. If there is any pitting then you should go ahead and replace the swivels, bearings and king pin or you'll forever be leaking. Follow the manual procedure for setting the swivel preload and you'll be amazed at how nice your steering will feel.

Of course it is easy to succumb to shipfitters disease. If you're doing teh axle then new steering ball joints make sense ... which then leads you to overhauling the steering relay and steerign box... and because she steers so nicely you might just want to overhaul the suspension .... but while your there you start looking at the chassis and then .... when you have a pile of parts on the floor I want your rear salisbury.

Good luck. It's a great truck to learn on.

Cheers
Gregor

[greenmeanie]

Standard?
These are grade 8 bolts aren't they?


Steve

Sorry, You are correct. In my business grade 8 or better is the standard. Sometimes I forget.

Cheers
Gregor

[Willard]

You have it right. Rear is a Salisbury and front a standard series. the 109 military models had a heavy duty chassis (GS versions did CL version were just civiy chassis) extended spring hangers and the square-like rear crossmember.
Some were 24 volt some 12. it depends on the purpose.
Check out http://www.emlra.org. great site for military Land Rovers.