Doing the Brakes - Easy Job?

[Bostonian1976]

This weekend I'll be replacing my rear brake shoes. I've done this on a Saturn before, but never on my Rover. Is there any sort of trickery I should be aware of? I'm assuming the job is pretty straightforward....

Thanks in advance..

[thixon]

Do you have an '88 or a 109? I can't remember. If I remember right, the bleeding procedure is different on the rear brakes of a 109. If you're just doing shoes, then its pretty intuitive. Most drum systems function in a similar manner. you'll sail through with no problems.

[Bostonian1976]

Do you have an '88 or a 109? I can't remember.

an 88 (or two)

[thixon]

It easy. You may have to beat on the drums with a rubber hammer to get them off. Depends on the shape they're in. Once they're off, its not big deal from there. Same basic procedure as what you did on the saturn. Good luck.

[yorker]

Piece of cake. You may have trouble with the screws in the drums if they are still there. Get some anti seize for when you put them back in.

[BackInA88]

Don't the drums have 2 tapped holes on the face?
Just screw in a couple bolts and jack the drum right off the flange.

For the flat head screws that hold the drum, if the hand style impact strips out the phillips.
I use a center punch on the edge of the screw head and with the punch on a angle whack it to break it loose.

Remember the top spring only attaches to the leading shoe (the one against the snail cam) and to a pin on the backing plate by the other shoe.

[greenmeanie]

The usual rule of only doing one side at a time so you have a reference to look at applies. Pay careful attention to the way the shoe return springs are attached as installing them incorrectly will lead to all kinds of fun trying to get things to work afterwards.

I suppose you could read the manual for that but where would the fun be?

Also, as this is the first time you have worked on these brakes so you don't know the age or composition of the shoes, wear a mask. In the old days shoes were made of asbestos which can rather ruin your day.


Cheers
Gregor

[Bostonian1976]

The usual rule of only doing one side at a time so you have a reference to look at applies. Pay careful attention to the way the shoe return springs are attached as installing them incorrectly will lead to all kinds of fun trying to get things to work afterwards.

I suppose you could read the manual for that but where would the fun be?

Also, as this is the first time you have worked on these brakes so you don't know the age or composition of the shoes, wear a mask. In the old days shoes were made of asbestos which can rather ruin your day.


Cheers
Gregor

wow - thanks - I didn't think of that. I have had someone in the family die of asbestos exposure, so I will be cautious.

re: the manual, I don't have one yet :(

[jp-]

Don't the drums have 2 tapped holes on the face?
Just screw in a couple bolts and jack the drum right off the flange.



Here's a handy tip, back off the brake shoe adjusters all the way before trying to get the drum off. If you don't, the shoes may hit the "lip" on the edge of the drum and could be very hard to get off.

[daveb]

rtfm, dude


This weekend I'll be replacing my rear brake shoes. I've done this on a Saturn before, but never on my Rover. Is there any sort of trickery I should be aware of? I'm assuming the job is pretty straightforward....

Thanks in advance..

[Bostonian1976]

rtfm, dude

don't have one. thanks though :D

[yorker]

wow - thanks - I didn't think of that. I have had someone in the family die of asbestos exposure, so I will be cautious.

re: the manual, I don't have one yet :(

you aren't going to die from changing the brakes once just use some common sense though. Buy a couple cans of Brake kleen. You probably should have bought a couple screws for the drums in case yours are all buggered up but you'll probably be fine. As for manuals (http://www.landrover.ee/est/varia/downloads/cars.htm):
http://www.roversnorth.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3716


http://www.bayourovers.com/trick14.html

[Bostonian1976]

very helpful - thanks very much guys

[daveb]

also learned some time ago there really is no need for the drum screws. if not installed carefully then you might think the drum is on all the way when it actually isn't. then you tighten the wheel nuts up and the wheel stops when it hits the screws which are actually out by 1/16" or so, undetected by you. then you go driving and the wheel rocks back and forth, pushing the brake drum back on, making the wheel nuts loose. if you are lucky you feel a pulsing in the brake pedal and hear odd noises, stop, investigate, and rectify. if you are less lucky the wheel passes you heading south on 95 while you grind to a stop...

oh yeah and the back of the wheel is all buggered up from riding against the screws...


you aren't going to die from changing the brakes once just use some common sense though. Buy a couple cans of Brake kleen. You probably should have bought a couple screws for the drums in case yours are all buggered up but you'll probably be fine. As for manuals (http://www.landrover.ee/est/varia/downloads/cars.htm):
http://www.roversnorth.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3716


http://www.bayourovers.com/trick14.html

[daveb]

my point exactly. young man, you ought to have one.



don't have one. thanks though :D

[Bostonian1976]

my point exactly. young man, you ought to have one.

I know :(

Spending money on other things...need to get one

[jp-]

I find that the only thing I really need my manual for these days is torque specs, and sometimes those aren't even listed!

[daveb]

yes, but you don't post asking how to install the brake shoes. The series trucks are pretty simple and you don't need the manual once you've been around one for a while. I do consult mine when tearing into gearboxes and the like, they tend to be full of valuable information. (go figure)

if there is no torque spec in the IIa guide I go and look in the SIII book. If there is none there, it just gets "tight"





I find that the only thing I really need my manual for these days is torque specs, and sometimes those aren't even listed!

[Bostonian1976]

yes, but you don't post asking how to install the brake shoes. The series trucks are pretty simple and you don't need the manual once you've been around one for a while.

only been around one for 3 years. and since my Rover isn't kept near me, I need to plan out my repair time and want to be sure I've covered all bases before starting the job, since I don't have a garage etc that I can leisurely work on it. so - that's why you see me posting things like this....

it's like those 'the more you know' commercials....

[scott]

a bleeding tip. i use a really long peice of clear tubing. long enough to go from the right rear bleeder to the resevior. a big binder type paper clip to hold the resevior end on so the it stays submerged. open the bleeder valve, grab a beer, and just sit there pumping 'til no more bubbles pass by.

[Bostonian1976]

ok got them all pulled apart - drums are like new, plenty of pad left on the shoes.

Driver's side brake was full of oil and goop....

passenger's completely dry

could this good be causing a 'shudder' that is pretty severe that sounds like metal on metal brakes almost when the brakes are applied (2nd pump)?

and what seal do I need for the hub to prevent further leakage into the brake? seems like an inner seal..
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3178/2464453192_15da033f9a_o.jpg

[pvkd]

You need a hub seal and likely a new Race. The only way you know is when you pull the hub off you can inspect the race on the spindle and see if it has a small groove in it (a flash light held at a angle can help you see this).

You may as well order a seal kit fro our hosts that way you will have the lock washer and felt seal.

[Jim-ME]

Make sure your breather on your axle is clear. It should rattle. If it doesn't I've had good luck cleaning them out with Gun Scrubber or brake cleaner. Also make sure to hole in the axle tube is clear or you will just blow another seal.
Jim

[Bostonian1976]

meh - note to self: don't hold the brake shoe away from the wheel cylinder for too long or the little flathead piece pops out, followed by the rubber piece that seals the brake system. I caught it just in time, but still think I got a little air in the system....

[Donnie]

a bleeding tip. i use a really long peice of clear tubing. long enough to go from the right rear bleeder to the resevior. a big binder type paper clip to hold the resevior end on so the it stays submerged. open the bleeder valve, grab a beer, and just sit there pumping 'til no more bubbles pass by.
While we are speaking of bleeding brakes...............I'd like to get a grip on the person that decided that 2 wheel cyls. per wheel was a better design, especially since the bleeder is on the BOTTOM cyl>>>>>>>anyone???

[yorker]

While we are speaking of bleeding brakes...............I'd like to get a grip on the person that decided that 2 wheel cyls. per wheel was a better design, especially since the bleeder is on the BOTTOM cyl>>>>>>>anyone???

swap them around:
http://gunsandrovers.yuku.com/topic/1914

http://gunsandrovers.yuku.com/topic/1985

[thixon]

swap them around:
http://gunsandrovers.yuku.com/topic/1914

http://gunsandrovers.yuku.com/topic/1985

Thanks Yorker,

that's the difference I was trying to remember early in the this thread. I've never owned a 109, but helped a guy near me do his brakes once years ago. All I remembered was that something about it pissed me off.

Bostonian,
If you don't already have one, go get and easy-bleed from NAPA/autozone/O'reilys etc. You may not be cracking open the system, but if you do, it will make it easier. Try to find the kind that uses the tire valve stem to pressurize the fluid canister. You can make one out of a garden sprayer, but thats another thread.

I like Jasons' method of bleeding mentioned earlier. The only danger is leaving small bubles in the system that you don't see, and recirculating them to into the system. Doesn't mean I havn't done it his way a million times, just something to be aware of.

You don't need to buy a manual, see my post from a while back.