Fuel Pump Question

[roverdave]

I'm having issues with fuel delivery to the carb on my 67 IIA. Just got a new fuel pump (with sediment bowl). The old fuel pump did not have the sediment bowl. I installed the new pump and can prime it by hand just fine - it delivers fuel all the way to the carb. When I crank the engine though, I get no output. Checked that the lines are tight and no obstructions (fuel tank is new, pickup new, etc..).

One thing I did notice is that the old fuel pump without the sediment bowl has a 1/4 inch black block between the fuel pump and the engine. There is a fuel pump gasket on both sides. Is this needed for the pump with the sediment bowl? I don't see this adapter block in any of the catalog pictures.

Any assitance appreciated.

Dave

[Daurie]

I don't have the book in front of me but I don't recollect any spacer between the block and the pump. Look into getting a service manual because if I remember correctly the engine needs to be turned to a certain point and then the pump put in. Someone with more info on this will chime in im sure.

good luck.

[graniterover]

4 or 6 cy?

A pic would help if you can get one.

[SafeAirOne]

Are the cam follower arms (the arms that sticks into the block and ride on the cam) the same length on both pumps?

Is the cam follower arm riding correctly on the cam?

I don't know about the series IIA, but looking at the Series III workshop manual, the 2 1/4 fuel pump mounts to a rectangular cover that then mounts to the engine block. Is this the 1/4" thick block to which you refer or is there something additional in your old setup?

For what it's worth, there is also a note that says that the pictured fuel pump (with sediment bowl) is for petrol engines and that the diesel engine pump is similar except that no filter bowl is required.

[roverdave]

My Rover is a 4 cyl. I'll pull the new one tonight and take some pics or both the new and old pump as well as the spacer I referred to. Thanks!
Dave



Are the cam follower arms (the arms that sticks into the block and ride on the cam) the same length on both pumps?

Is the cam follower arm riding correctly on the cam?

I don't know about the series IIA, but looking at the Series III workshop manual, the 2 1/4 fuel pump mounts to a rectangular cover that then mounts to the engine block. Is this the 1/4" thick block to which you refer or is there something additional in your old setup?

For what it's worth, there is also a note that says that the pictured fuel pump (with sediment bowl) is for petrol engines and that the diesel engine pump is similar except that no filter bowl is required.

[1961 109 WAGON]

ive seen this block, its a black almost plastic type thing.i think its for if the arm the rides on the cam is longer. i have one in my parts bins

[BrianC]

Hi Roverdave, Have you solved the problem yet? If not, there is a metal block with a slot that the fuel pump lever goes through. This metal plate mounts to the side of the block. The fuel pump lever must go under the cam lobe inside the block in order for the pump action to occur. When mounting, you will actually depress the lever downward against the cam lobe when you install the pump assembly. As for the sediment bowl, diesel models prior to suffix K had a sediment bowl. From suffix K onward, there was no bowl. All petrol models have the bowl. As for the plastic block....maybe the P.O. installed an aftermarket pump with a longer lever and added a spacer.....Good Luck. Let us know how it goes. Brian

[roverdave]

I did get it working tonight. I took a bunch of pics yesterday of both the new and old pumps but my home computer died (been one of those weeks) and I could not include in the post. I removed the plastic block and bolted the new pump directly to the engine and it worked! I did compare the arms - both looked the same length but the one without the sediment bowl had a different shape arm (more angular vs the smooth curve of the new pump). Once I get the computer back up I'll post the pics for future reference.

The engine fired up pretty quickly - surprising as I haven't had it running in two years. It has a Zenith Carb - I bought a rebuild kit from RN and rebuilt it before putting in the pump. It runs but it seems to be running very rich - filled my garage with smoke. Next step is to get it tuned. Please chime in if you have any tips! Thanks! :thumb-up:




Hi Roverdave, Have you solved the problem yet? If not, there is a metal block with a slot that the fuel pump lever goes through. This metal plate mounts to the side of the block. The fuel pump lever must go under the cam lobe inside the block in order for the pump action to occur. When mounting, you will actually depress the lever downward against the cam lobe when you install the pump assembly. As for the sediment bowl, diesel models prior to suffix K had a sediment bowl. From suffix K onward, there was no bowl. All petrol models have the bowl. As for the plastic block....maybe the P.O. installed an aftermarket pump with a longer lever and added a spacer.....Good Luck. Let us know how it goes. Brian

[Les Parker]

http://www.roversnorth.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3121

Hope this helps !!

[SeriesShorty]

So I put the manifold all back together, minus the front pipe. Slapped the freshly cleaned Weber 34ICH back on. Installed the shiney new fuel pump w/ sediment bowl. And got nothing.

Primed the pump by hand and filled the sediment bowl. Still nothing. Kept primping until I could see it completely fill the inline filter.

Yippee! Started right up and ran. Until the filter emptied.

Tested the pump and it's not pumping. It will only push fuel when I manually prime the lever.

Checked out this thread about the internal lever needing to be under the cam lobe. I checked the Haynes manual and the green bible and I'm not finding any info on how to correctly reinstall the pump.

I've bumped the engine a few times thinking I would be able to get the lever under it and no dice.

Any help to get this thing installed and working is appreciated!

Jen

[Moose]

Checked out this thread about the internal lever needing to be under the cam lobe. I checked the Haynes manual and the green bible and I'm not finding any info on how to correctly reinstall the pump.

Jen

That could be your problem. The lever on the pump needs to be above the cam because the lever moves upwards to create the pumping action. It's not going to work if the lever is below the cam lobe.

Brett

[SeriesShorty]

Thanks Brett. From what I can tell, it is physically impossible to get the fuel pump arm under the cam anyways. All I know is, I've taken this thing on and off about 5 times now and I'm really frustrated. It's got allen bolts so it's very tedious turning that little allen wrench over and over and...I digress.

I even reinstalled the old pump, and now it isn't working either.

The new pump will definately pull fuel when I prime it manually, so why isn't the darn thing supplying fuel after it's been primed?

Installation seems so straight forward that I don't know what I could be missing...

[rovers2a]

clean the tank. remove the fuel pick up tube. check for the screen on the bottom of the pick up its soldered on there. clean the 90 degree brass elbow on the pick up. check your fuel lines and or blow compressed air though back to the tank, kind of reverse flush, you will hear the bubles at the tank. i just went through all this crap with a 88 diesel. vehicle would run fine then die off. fuel starvation. turns out to be debris clogging the 90 degree brass elbow on top of the tank. also the fuel line was plugged with gritty black stuff.

[rovers2a]

also check the fuel line connection on top of the tank. it seems to me that the system is drawwing air from some where. sometimes the steel pick up tube peforates half way up. then you start drawing air. check for peforations in the line to the fuel pump. maybe chaffing somewhere and now there might be a hole. you could also try running fresh fuel line straight into a 1 gallon fuel can. this will then rule out any part of the system prior to the fuel pump.

[rovers2a]

are there twin tanks? its a MOD landy right? if it has twin tanks check the cross over valve is functioning properly.

[SeriesShorty]

also check the fuel line connection on top of the tank. it seems to me that the system is drawwing air from some where. sometimes the steel pick up tube peforates half way up. then you start drawing air. check for peforations in the line to the fuel pump. maybe chaffing somewhere and now there might be a hole. you could also try running fresh fuel line straight into a 1 gallon fuel can. this will then rule out any part of the system prior to the fuel pump.

Funny you mention air in the system. While priming by hand, as soon I stop pumping the lever, I can hear air escape at the pump or the valve, maybe the connection on one of the fuel lines after the valve body.

I actually had it working for about 20 seconds last night, I saw little shots of fuel squirt into the filter. Then it just stopped. As long as I keep priming manually the engine stays running.

I'll try dropping the line in a can of gas to see what happens as soon as get to feeling better. Darn flu bug hit me early this morning. :(

Thanks for the tips!

[rovers2a]

24 oz flu? also check the gasket and connection on the glass sediment bowl. if that isnt seated right it may be drawinf the air.

[SeriesShorty]

[quote=rovers2a]24 oz flu? quote]

ROFL Where I live they call that variety of illness the Forty-Flu yo!

But thanks to Airborne I'm already feeling better and will probably get back to work on this fuel starvation monday evening. After a trip to Walgreens for some more OFF bugspray...darn flying critters have been vicious that past few days!