Timing help please!

[Clive]

2.25 gas with 8:1 head (Turner motor) and Petronix ignition. I have been told that the timing chould be set at everything from 6 deg BTDC to 3 deg ATDC!! Can anyone tell me what it REALLY should be! At sea level, Florida, and confused.

[singingcamel]

shooooooooot,
the best timing light i've ever had was a fruit jar half full of water.
directions for use easy to follow as well.
#1 loosen the dizzy at the base.
#2 set jar on the wing.
#3 advance or retard the timing until water in the fruit jar is as smooth as you can get.
#4 tighten the dizzy .
#5 to easy
www.singingcamel.com

[Jeff Aronson]

2.25 gas with 8:1 head (Turner motor) and Petronix ignition. I have been told that the timing chould be set at everything from 6 deg BTDC to 3 deg ATDC!! Can anyone tell me what it REALLY should be! At sea level, Florida, and confused.

Hi Clive,

The reason for the variation is that Rover did not know what the fuel quality would - or would not - be. The Turner motor with the 8:1 head will have great power [for a 2.25] but it might require mid-grade gasoline so as not to "ping" under load.

First, try some regular gas and set the timing to 0 degrees TDC. If you have any inclines, put the car in a high gear and force it up a hill. If you hear a "pink" or rattle under load, then it's running too advanced. Lower it to 3 degrees BTDC and try it again.

With a new engine, the engine should run very, very smoothly. I once had my engine running very smoothly but discovered that I had it advanced much too far. So use a timing light to start. If you have no pinging and the "water jar" doesn't wiggle, you've got it right.

If it runs smoothly but still diesels a bit after turning it off, or if you get some pinging, then try mid-grade gas. I've had to use it on my 8:1 rebuild almost from the time I had the engine installed.

Enjoy the new power!

Jeff

[jp-]

I was always told to retard the timing til it almost dies, then advance until it almost dies, and set it in the middle...

Is this wrong?

This is assuming that you don't have a timing light handy.

[Rod Turnbull]

been there done that

Here is another fun way without a light... put on the E-break, put it in gear, have someone push down on the gas and break at the same time, so it is under load but not moving (when I'm alone I put it against a brick wall and use the throttle cable to, well, never mind)... advance it till it starts to ping and then turn it back just a bit till it stops.

When someone tries something stupid like I'm suggesting, don't be surprised if you run yourself over. Take that as my legal disclaimer.

Rod

[Clive]

There are some great suggestions here - but I will reserve the Turnbull "Wall Technique" for the last resort and make sure I have someone videoing it for posterity!!

Meantime last night I set it to 3 deg ATDC - absolutely no power today, couldn't get above 40 mph even with the wind behind! But it ran smoothly and the water didn't shake. Using regular gas. Today I will set it at TDC and work up from there....and after exhausting timing options try the mid-range gas. Many thanks.

[Rod Turnbull]

Copies of Video Tape

Did I mention the part about not standing between the Rover and the wall?

Best of luck.
Rod

[jp-]

Here is another fun way without a light... put on the E-break, put it in gear, have someone push down on the gas and break at the same time, so it is under load but not moving (when I'm alone I put it against a brick wall and use the throttle cable to, well, never mind)... advance it till it starts to ping and then turn it back just a bit till it stops.

When someone tries something stupid like I'm suggesting, don't be surprised if you run yourself over. Take that as my legal disclaimer.

Rod

Rod,

You can't load a stick shift the way you can an automatic. If you have it in gear and it's not moving, you're slipping the clutch. This is bad.

[Jeff Aronson]

There are some great suggestions here - but I will reserve the Turnbull "Wall Technique" for the last resort and make sure I have someone videoing it for posterity!!

Meantime last night I set it to 3 deg ATDC - absolutely no power today, couldn't get above 40 mph even with the wind behind! But it ran smoothly and the water didn't shake. Using regular gas. Today I will set it at TDC and work up from there....and after exhausting timing options try the mid-range gas. Many thanks.

Umm, something doesn't sound right here. Before you touch the timing, have you gapped the points? Are they new and clean? This needs to happen before you consider changing the timing.

Jeff

[Clive]

I have installed a Petronix electronic ignition (newer type Lucas distributor) so no points to adjust.....(unless I am missing something!) however, last night I set it to 3 deg BTDC with the light and I have a bunch more power today. Still doesn't feel as powerful as it should though.
Another question - when setting the timing with a light should I diconnect the vacuum hose and set it that way, then reconnect the hose and adjust idle to 750 rpm? Many thanks for all the input, it is getting better all the time!

[singingcamel]

does it idle o.k.? how about when you revve the engine? any hesitation ?
if it idles ok without a noticable miss out the exhaust ,you should be close.
if there is no obstruction to the carb linkage, carb is set right, the next thing to do is pull plugs one at a time and check compression,125- 145 lbs/sq "if your down one one cylinder you may have dropped a valve (burnt) causing a loss of compression in one clyinder,causing poor preformance.(no power)

[Clive]

Thanks. It seems to idle completely smoothly @750 rpm (set the mixture in a new Weber single barrel), and 3 deg BTDC. Takes a few turns of the motor to start when hot, and also runs on a bit after turning off.

When I rev it feels like there may be hesitation sometimes...but difficult to be sure as i don't have enough experience of this. What does hesitation mean?

[Clive]

Compression is 160+ in all cylinders (8:1 head). Engine still diesels and doesn't backfire but definitely "burbles" on deceleration. No evident leaks around manifolds or pipe....

[Bostonian1976]

you still definitely have timing issues according to your previous post (2 posts ago)

[Clive]

Yep - I think there is still an issue - it does not seem to have the power an 8:1 head should. I've checked the brakes aren't dragging, and the T-brake. New Wber carb set to corect mix.
But everything checks out unless I try going to 6 deg BTDC or beyond? What sort of damage if I advance the timing too much?