New Project Rover – Brakes Repairs & Low Compression

[Winston-Rover]

Hi Folks,
I'm a new member, although I;ve been reading the posts for several months now. I just purchased my first series rover, a 1971 Series IIa SWB (it’s my 2nd Land Rover, I also have a 2000 Discovery II). I hope to get some pictures posted of the “new” rover soon.

The first thing I’ve done so far was a brake inspection and a compression test.

Brakes: the brakes need a complete overhall. New shoes, cylinders, rubber lines. The drums are smooth inside but look pretty old on the outside (surface rust). Should I leave the drums as is, get them resurfaced, or replace them? What’s the minimum drum thickness? How do I test the vacuum booster? I thought I saw a post on this before but can’t find it now.

Compression test: cylinders 1, 2, 4 (numbered from front to back) were at 160 psi. cylinder 3 was at 90 psi. I squirted oil into cylinder 3 and retested and it still came back at 90 psi. this indicates a leak at the valves and not pistons, correct? Does this mean that I need a complete valve job? Or is there a way to clean the valve (assuming that carbon buildup is the problem)? should I even be concerned with this, or should I run it as it?

Also, I just purchased the Haynes Restoration Manual & Haynes Service and Repair Manual. Are there any other useful manuals that I should consider?

Thanks

[TSR53]

Welcome to the forum! Yes, photos are always great to see, please post when you get a chance.

[KingSlug]

I would suggest doing a valve adjustment and tuneup then checking the compression again. If you are holding some compression, it might be the valve is too tight and leaking or some carbon build up. An easy way to clean out carbon assuming the engine runs is remove the everything above the carb, warm up the engine, with a spray bottle and just water bring the engine up to a reasonable running speed, shoot a few squirts of water down the throat of the carb, the engine will lug then pick up again, repeat, I usually do a complete spray bottle. Its engine steam cleaning, be sure the exhaust it pointed in a safe direction so you dont paint your garage with carbon guk.

I would suggest you get a copy of the Green Bible, much better than any other manual. You can find an online copy: Here (http://www.seriestrek.com/manuals.html)

Do you have a problem with the brakes? I would replace the fluid and adjust them, if the fluid is black/creamy/rusty or you have leaks I would start tackling that problem. Again refer to the GB.

[jp-]

Welcome to the forum! Yes, photos are always great to see, please post when you get a chance.

You could make it easier to post photos, by raising the ,ahem, pathetic 39kb limit.

[jp-]

I shoot a few squirts of water down the throat of the carb, the engine will lug then pick up again, repeat, I usually do a complete spray bottle.

I've never heard this before, but it sounds risky.

King, how do you know it works? Have you done a disassembly after trying this?

Because I can see some potential for engine damage if you're not careful.

[KingSlug]

Its an old mech trick, yes it works. Try googling it. You are only misting water down the carb not dumping a straight gallon. If you have a cooking pan thats all carboned up and you dont want to scrub, place water in it an bring it to a boil, taddah.

Look down this page:

http://www.hotrod.com/tipstricks/41918/index5.html

We used a timed water injection system on a Lister 12/2 CS diesel that ran on used motor oil. The water injection kept every thing inside bright and shiney, if the water ran out the injectors would clog in an hour. The light gen ran 24/7 sometimes all summer, it was started and finished on diesel. There is a big difference between diesel and used motor oil and water made up the difference.

Here is another cute old engine trick. Your truck idles fine but cuts out at freeway speeds. With the air cleaner off get as much rpm as possible and slap you hand over the carb and let it choke. You are hoping the vacuum will pull any junk/dirt out of the carbs holes and orfices, this will normally return the engine to normal conditions and is sometime cause by crab in the fuel the stock LR filter wont catch but check the fuel filter also.

[TSR53]

Request granted :thumb-up:. [actually, no one ever asked before...]

Now it's set to 235.2k max file size, max width 1024 x max height 768.

TS



You could make it easier to post photos, by raising the ,ahem, pathetic 39kb limit.

[jp-]

Thanks,

Thompson

[jp-]

Thanks for the link King.

There's some neat stuff there.

By the way, where did you get the water injection setup for generator?

How did you meter the amount of water being injected?

What was the rate of water to fuel (or oil)?

[KingSlug]

JP,

We just built it using some electronic parts, a mister, a couple valves and a pump. It is really basic, because the Lister runs at 650 rpm the injection really just limits the water intake. The misters goes off once every 3 seconds for each cylinder or 1.5 seconds for the engine and because of over spray and residuals it evens out, the water amount was adjusted until the idle was a close to even as possible. I dont have the fuel vs water figures as it was my pop's project, but he is an engineer and I am sure he has all the documentation.

The next lister gen build is a two 8/1 listeroids tied to the same generator. I am going to try a pure mechanical fuel/water mixing through the injector for waste motor oil. If I remember the optimum mixture for diesel fuel is 5% water, 95% diesel in a mixing situtation.

On the land rover front I have thought about this:
http://www.motherearthnews.com/DIY/1979-11-01/Ron-Novak-s-Do-It-Yourself-Water-Injection-System.aspx
http://www.motherearthnews.com/gallery.aspx?id=66892

or

http://www.dave-cushman.net/misc/mannject.html

[yorker]

I've never heard this before, but it sounds risky.

King, how do you know it works? Have you done a disassembly after trying this?

Because I can see some potential for engine damage if you're not careful.

It is one of those well established old tricks. Some people used brake fluid, oil of peppermint etc. Think of them as old time home remedies for engines.

[Jeff Aronson]

Yes, it really does work. The "Car Talk" guys have referenced it on radio, too. I have some old issues of Motor, from the 1950's, when you could buy an "Atomic Mister" that would spray some water through your system to "decoke" the head every so often.

If and when you pull the head, you'll probably find quite a lot of carbonized gunk along the edge of the cylinder and the head. That's the stuff that can interfere with with the valves, too.

As for your compression, good point about adjusting the valves and then retesting the compression. 90 psi is clearly on the low side, but the car will run for some time before you'll need to do a valve job. You'll be down on power some, but it's functional. I know because I've run mine with a lot less compression.

The test you really want is a blow-by or leak down test. That's the one that will test the rings for you.

Have fun,

Jeff

[Winston-Rover]

I just confirmed with my buddies dad who is a retired mechanic and shop owner - he actually suggested to do this before I even asked. so I think I'll try it this week.

thanks for the help.

[J!m]

That low compression could be a burnt valve from no-lead fuel...

[singingcamel]

just make sure your brake drums are true, you may want to turn them to true em up.
maximum thickness of your drums should be stamped on them.(original drums)
replace your brake components, don't rebuild!
i agree with adjusting your valves the redo your compression test.
if you have to redo your heads put the stellate valves seats.then you can burn unleaded.
i doubt if your rings are bad,probably valves...marc
www.singingcamel.com (http://www.singingcamel.com)










Hi Folks,





I'm a new member, although I;ve been reading the posts for several months now. I just purchased my first series rover, a 1971 Series IIa SWB (it’s my 2nd Land Rover, I also have a 2000 Discovery II). I hope to get some pictures posted of the “new” rover soon.

The first thing I’ve done so far was a brake inspection and a compression test.

Brakes: the brakes need a complete overhall. New shoes, cylinders, rubber lines. The drums are smooth inside but look pretty old on the outside (surface rust). Should I leave the drums as is, get them resurfaced, or replace them? What’s the minimum drum thickness? How do I test the vacuum booster? I thought I saw a post on this before but can’t find it now.

Compression test: cylinders 1, 2, 4 (numbered from front to back) were at 160 psi. cylinder 3 was at 90 psi. I squirted oil into cylinder 3 and retested and it still came back at 90 psi. this indicates a leak at the valves and not pistons, correct? Does this mean that I need a complete valve job? Or is there a way to clean the valve (assuming that carbon buildup is the problem)? should I even be concerned with this, or should I run it as it?

Also, I just purchased the Haynes Restoration Manual & Haynes Service and Repair Manual. Are there any other useful manuals that I should consider?

Thanks

[schultp]

Thanks for the link King.

There's some neat stuff there.

By the way, where did you get the water injection setup for generator?

How did you meter the amount of water being injected?

What was the rate of water to fuel (or oil)?

One simple trick is to hook up your windshield washer via tubing to the carb. Fill the fluid reservoir with water. As you drive down the street you just activate the washer pump and viola! Steam cleaning as you go.

Paul.