Carb. Rebuild or replace?

[2manykids4a7]

This is a follow up post from points to pertronix. In the course of making that switch I have discovered the following so to keep the 2 issues separate I thought I'd start this new thread, I should say that I haven't had a chance to even look into the issue yet I just didn't want to confuse the other thread with this issue.

The throttle shaft on my carb is worn, which if I understand things correctly means that air can get into the carb thus making it run lean which could be a contributing factor to the popping sound I get from the exhaust when I back off the gas. It seems my choices are as follows.

1. Get the throttle shaft on the carb rebuilt. Trevor (the automotive teacher, at the community college where I work) recommended having this done by a professional as it requires some fairly skilled work to get new bushings put in place etc.

2. Get a new carb.

So I'm off to explore those options, cost etc.

Carb is a Zenith. (Has 36 IV on it too)

If anyone has thoughts, experience, questions, advice etc please let me know.

Thanks, Steve..

1975 Series III 109 FFR reduced to 12V. 2.25L engine.

[bkreutz]

I think your biggest difficulty is finding someone who has the ability to rebuild your carb. Putting in new bushings to correct worn throttle shafts used to be a common part of a carb overhaul, but as the years have gone by, the number of places that can do this correctly has dwindled (or disappeared). The other factor to consider is the condition of the rest of the carb. I'd look and ask around to see if you can find a reputable rebuilder (lean heavily on recommendations of past customers). If you find them, let them assess the condition of your carb and give recommendations on what should be done. HTH

[gudjeon]

If you have had good luck with this carb in the past and someone has the ability and know how to restore the shaft, then I would go for. But, then again, this is just me.:thumb-up: You won't get a simpler carb to rebuild than these. OK, maybe your lawnmover.

[2manykids4a7]

Thanks fellas, I appreciate the advice.

So after a little while searching this is where I have ended up.

It seems like you can talk (read) yourself both in to or out of a whole variety of different carbs.

I mainly use the vehicle to take the kids to the beach, around town on the weekends, as a stand in when something is in the shop etc. It isn't a daily driver and I'm not doing any serious off-roading (or even casual off-roading unless you count the odd building site or the beach with the kids!). So gas mileage and off road performance are not that big a deal to me, reliability is the name of the game.

That said since this Zenith has been working for me so far, it seems like a good first port of call is looking into getting it fixed. I do have a recommendation of a shop here in town so I plan on taking it there and getting some expert advice. If the cost isn't prohibitive in comparison with a replacement (so far I have seen a Zenith for $150 and a Weber for about $240 (courtesy of our hosts)) I think I will give that a shot. However if it is close to the same price to replace it I may go that way get a warranty for a while and once again lean on the guys in the automotive shop to get me set up nicely.

If anyone has more thoughts please don't hesitate to chime in. I will keep this thread updated with my progress.

Steve..

[luckyjoe]

If you start to see big $$$ to correct the shaft wear, I would consider locating a Zenith in better condition, then rebuilding that one. A lot of people switch carbs and replace the Zenith. So there should be quite a few people with a Zenith sitting on their shelf, ready to trade for a few beer tokens.

As stated, it's a simple rebuild, even as your first carb...

Regards,

[2manykids4a7]

Went by the carburetor specialist in town today and his recommendation was for $150 to get the replacement. It would be more expensive to repair the shaft and even if I could find another with the shaft in better shape a rebuild kit is then $100.

Seems to make sense to me, I will probably hold off on ordering for couple of days just in case anyone has any better ideas.

Once again, thanks for the input. Steve..

[2manykids4a7]

Seems like my best option to replace the Zenith is to get one sent over from England. I hope that I'm not breaking any forum rules here (I think I'm OK as RN does not sell the Zenith), if I am please do let me know. Has anyone had any experience with these guys?

http://www.lrseries.com/shop/product/listing/4971/ERC2886-CARBURETTOR-ZENITH-TYPE.html?search=zenith&page=1

Thanks, Steve..

[yorker]

Ask around some more- post on Guns and Rovers and I bet you'll find a good carb or a good rebuildable core. I've bought like new Webers on ebay for $10 before.

[kevkon]

It's not the seller I'd be concerned with, rather the maker of the "Zenith Type" carb, Britpart.

[gudjeon]

Not to diss the hosts, but, I bought a genuine Zenith From PA Blanshards and had in my Canuck mitts in 10 days.:thumb-up:

[2manykids4a7]

Thanks guys. I had kind of settled on the "get a new one so I know what I am starting with idea" but I may explore the used option again.

So to cut to the chase is this one of those situations where the $60 I save (I don't save this much on the carb only but I'm getting a couple of other things too) going with the UK order not worth it in the long run? Am I better to get a genuine replacement Zenith and avoid Britpart? Obviously this is a percentages game but are there enough Britpart issues that the smart money is avoiding them?

Thanks, Steve..

[gudjeon]

If your going to all that trouble and ordering overseas, My money would be on the better one.:thumb-up:

[2manykids4a7]

Overseas is no trouble for me, all my family is still in England and I still keep a credit card with a British address. It is purely an economics question! I don't mind the wait for parts from the UK if it saves me money, but if it costs me more in the long run then I'll spend the extra now. I'm fairly new to Rovers and am not yet familiar with when it is best to go with OEM replacements etc. Hence my questions about the quality of Britpart. I have worked on other vehicles before where all you are paying for with original replacements is the name and that isn't a concern for me with my Rover.

I should again take the chance to say how much I appreciate the opportunity to be able to ask questions from those who have gone before and do my best to avoid the trial and error mistakes, I would otherwise be making.

Thanks, Steve..

[yorker]

There is a reason why Britpart parts are known as $hitpart on the UK LR boards. If you are going to buy new spend the $ on the real deal, though even that may warp on you apparently.

[luckyjoe]

If you plan on replacing the Zenith, I'd go with these guys: http://www.burlen.co.uk/
They have a good reputation in the S2 Club.

As far as economy, a dollar saved is a dollar earned, or something like that. If you don't quite feel up to the task of rebuilding the carb, then a reconditioned Burlen unit should greatly simplify things for you, and you'll not be second-guessing yourself as you bolt it on.

Regards,

[2manykids4a7]

Yorker, thanks for the heads up. Tom, I went to the site but they didn't have an entire replacement for the Zenith, they just had parts, thanks though.

So my plan is to replace the old Zenith with a new one, dollars wise it isn't horrible, $150. I know there are cheaper options but this won't break the bank. I intend to have the Rover for a long time so I think this gives me the best starting point. I know there is always a chance any part will not come up to par but hopefully I have minimized that chance. If I do get a dud then I'm buying from a reputable source and so should be able to get my money back and then look for a used carb with a decent throttle shaft that I can then rebuild.

I'll post up once the new one arrives and is installed.

Thanks for the help, Steve..

[luckyjoe]

Steve,

Report back how everything works out.

For a complete Zenith, you need to call Burlen. They don't show it on their web site...

Don't throw your old carb away! I'll gladly take it if it's destined for the bin!

Regards,

[2manykids4a7]

Tom, I got impatient last night and just pulled the trigger (would have been too late to call UK anyway). I'm afraid the carb isn't headed for the rubbish, for now I think rebuilding the throttle shaft is a little beyond me (hopefully one day I may be there), but since it is getting me around right now, it will go in the spares box.

I'll be back once the new one is on there..

[Les Parker]

I am sure I am not alone in having some spare "core" Zeniths if any body wants some, couple of gallons of gas money and the shipping and they could be yours !!

[2manykids4a7]

Les,

Thanks that is really kind of you, if my present plan fails I will take you up on your offer.

Steve..

[Tsmith]

The quality of the replacement Zeniths is terrible. I got three when I had a SIII from different sources. They required rebulding out of the box to attain flat mating surfaces. I finally learned to anneal them, flat the parts and re-assemble. I noticed the first one leaking fuel from the sides right after installing it.

You may be better off having the original one rebuilt, even if it is more costly. Try Joe Curto, 718 762 7878.

Carburetors were made better when manufacturers installed tham on new cars that had warrentees. No cars have carbs anymore and the warrentee ia only a month or two and has little meaning anyway.

[2manykids4a7]

Well, the order is in now so hopefully I either get a good one, or if not it has issues quickly and the warranty comes through. Probably will be a couple of weeks until I get it fitted, I will keep everyone posted once I make progress (or not!).

Steve..

[2manykids4a7]

I finally fitted the replacement carb and the initial results are good. My original problem was a fairly loud popping sound usually occurring when I let off the gas. The general consensus was that I was probably running lean. Since I was running points that was where the trouble shooting started, and the first find was a fair amount of slop in the distributor shaft which clearly made for a gap issue with the points. Distributor was replaced and points removed in favor of a Pertronix system, but the popping remained. Examination of the carb led to the discovery of wear in the throttle shaft, letting air in, hence the lean mix. After considering the options and the $ I went for a direct replacement Zenith. Initial results are good everything seems to be running smoothly and there have been no disturbing bangs or pops as yet. I know it is early days but there are no leaks either. I hope to run it by the auto shop at the college where I work and have the guys there give it the once over and see if there are any adjustments they would make. But right now I am pleased with the results.

Thanks for all the input along the way, I will post up any developments if they occur.

Steve..

[2manykids4a7]

Quick update for anyone who may be considering this replacement.

Although initial results with the carb were good it started running really rich and I couldn't get it adjusted right using the idle and mix screws only (no idea why it ran well at first). Took it to a friend who is a mechanic and after he tried the same thing he thought it might be an issue with the float. I was going to try and get to it myself, but life got busy and I wanted it fixed before I lost more time that could be spent enjoying the thing! So I took it back to him and he fixed it right up. He said the float was the problem, so he replaced it with the float from the original. I guess the float in the new replacement was foam and all bent up wheras the original was plastic and sat level (as it should per the green bibles directions). He also said the original needle valve looked better quality too, so he switched that out.

So I now have a new carb with the float and the needle valve from the old carb. As far as cost goes getting the replacement and then getting it fixed has come out at about the same cost as it would have been to get the old one rebuilt. I guess I am a little ahead this way, since if nothing else I have gained a few spares, some knowledge for myself and now have someone smarter than I who is getting to know the Rover a little.

Hopefully this is my last post on this one!

Steve..

[BobJones]

Where did you end up getting the new Zenith from?

[2manykids4a7]

PM'd you. Steve..

[Lord Icon]

It's just my 2 cents. I am rebuilding my second series 3 , just rebuilt a unimog.
Both had poor running carbs, both were zenith. I changed the last rover over to a webber and the pertronix conversion and was amazed at the new power and ease of starting at below 0 degrees. The unimog got a pertronix kit and a carter knock off by Holly, ( I now hold the patent for this upgrade) . The zenith design loads too much torque on the throttle and will wear the hole into a oval. You can JB weld a repair but for the money the webber is a way better investment. My only issue with the webber is the smaller throat , you will need to adapt it to your air intake. Autozone has a make yer own air intake system, you just have to paint the chrome when done. As with all things that use fuel, heating , a/c, fire, explosives, rover combustion, you and me breathing....... ESTABLISH PROPER AIR FLOW. The better it can breath the better it can burn, that's why the blowers and turbos and nos upgrades are so popular with the racing crowd... I am contemplating a british blower assy, I will source one at the upcoming British Invasion in 2 weeks..
Cheers,
Kris Heikkila
1973 Hodge Podge.....:thumb-up: