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Thread: Should I install this? Or send it back?

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Apr 2021
    Location
    SF Bay Area
    Posts
    97

    Default Should I install this? Or send it back?

    I just bought a new half-shaft because mine was all mangled/scratched around the shaft housing that fits inside the hub. It's an aftermarket... Bearmach brand.. says "made in India"... and not purchased from our hosts.

    I got the package today after a 1.5 week wait shipping from the UK. I opened up the package and I looked at the part and noticed it's really poorly machined. The casting looks okay, but the bore hole for the universal joint is off-center. One of the side-walls is 0.155" thick and the other side is 0.219". It's enough to be visibly unbalanced, and worryingly thin on the thin side . I mean, it's like an 1/8" of metal holding my entire drive train together on that side. This has me worried.

    Should I install this on my car, or send it back for another one?
    It might not be an issue, but it's a rotating assembly...and that much "visible" offset tells me it's going to wobble at higher speeds. But then again, it's nearly at the wheel, so the RPM isn't going to be that high. But then again, a couple grams difference in tire wear and they put weights on the rim to balance that. A little bit matters, right? So, this much metal shifted over ( I'm thinking of the U joint also sitting offset because of this ) would definitely cause some wobble. How could no one notice this at Baermach?! The quality control is terrible! I'm throwing John Craddock under the bus here, too...as they supplied it. But it was cheap, I share the blame for picking it.

    I've been waiting 3 weeks with my Landy on jack stands in front of my house because of this. I hate to wait another 2 weeks. But, I'd have more money into just the non-reusable supporting parts (genuine bearing races, retainer clips, gear oil) than this part costs. I think I only paid $25-$30 new for it, and the bearing races that is press-fit on it costs $60(genuine LR). So, I hate to put it on and have to remove it, 3 weeks later and have to re-order new bearing races, etc.

    I just hate to lose all this time more than anything.

    Any advice from the community? Check out these pics...

    Click image for larger version. 

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    For reference, here is what my current Half-Shaft looks like:
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Notice the crazy gouges on the shaft. I don't think anything sits on there...but it's been rubbing on the hub assembly, clearly. The front differential was also bone-dry, and the bolts were all loose (vibration loosening, I think). I am replacing everything, by the way...swivel balls, seals, bolts, hub, wheel bearings, u-joint, etc. It will all be sitting in some nice new grease and gear oil, with fresh seals...but this stupid new part has be re-thinking if I should order a new replacement...or re-use the old one...or just put this offset one in there???
    ...┌───────┬──,,
    ...|______OD__|__\\_____
    ...d ..__ ......... |... | ..__....p
    └/ | \────┴──┴/ | \─┘≡
    ..../..@........................@

    1973 Series 3, 109

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    162

    Default

    if it breaks you'd send it back anyway with the same result about a refund but looking at that i think you'd want a spare on hand!

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2021
    Location
    SF Bay Area
    Posts
    97

    Default

    I ordered a new one from RovahFarm. Sorry hosts, the only one you guys sell is the Genuine and it's $250. Hoping Trevah can get me the new one before. ext weekend...$75. If this one is wonky, I might bite the bullet and get the Genuine one. But let's see.

    Also ordered some extra parts to fully finish out the job. I have no excuse but to finish this project after next weekend!!
    ...┌───────┬──,,
    ...|______OD__|__\\_____
    ...d ..__ ......... |... | ..__....p
    └/ | \────┴──┴/ | \─┘≡
    ..../..@........................@

    1973 Series 3, 109

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    162

    Default

    sort of related but back in the 70's when i drove the freeway a lot I had to replace the shorter rear half shaft maybe 3 times. Somewhere I heard that there was a temperature difference that'd weaken the metal at the differential. It always broke inside the diff making getting it out a hassel. One time doing so I found the ring gear had sheared all but one bolt. I still can't figure out what held it together but the upshot of it was something about lubricant dispersal at the differential. I haven't had any issue again but then my rovers are never on flat ground very long anymore but has anyone else heard of anything like this?

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2021
    Location
    SF Bay Area
    Posts
    97

    Default

    @jimrr: On a related note to your comment, I was trying to get to the bottom of what gear oil to out in my diff after fixing all this. My reprint owners manual(it's adorable, they sell them on Amazon) says EP90, but also 140 weight gear oil. Wondering if you were in a a part of the country that was hotter or colder than Sollihull, England and should use one viscosity and not the other? I don't know...

    [Update on this part.] Two other suppliers didn't have them. RovahFarm didn't have the part for a while, so I ordered another Baermach one from a different supplier. RoversNorth didn't offer one, which is sad because I was at my whit's end and even ready to pay "Genuine"+++$$$ prices, I wanted one so bad. After much delay, the new halfshaft came yesterday.

    This one seems to have a more centered machined bore. That's good. I took out my old Axle assembly and cleaned it up today. Went to replace the U joint in there and the new half shaft, re-using the inside Axle shaft because it looks good still. I get nearly done and the u-joint won't seat far enough for the cap to clear the inner slot and let me fit the circlip in. They machined it wrong! It's about 0.03 off. So frustrating. I was hammering it like crazy and double checking no pins came out of the u-joint caps. Everything is aligned and fine, it's just the new yoke is a tiny bit too small. I can just BARELY see the slot.

    So, I took out both circlips(c-clips) and basically planed them down -0.01 each on sandpaper...like how you sharpen chisels and plane blades in woodworking. Dang, it took forever. But I was able to get them both in. But now it's too stiff. I think I'm going to take both c-clips out again and try to shave them down another 0.005. I wish I could just buy thinner c-clips but the internet has no idea what I'. talking about. I can't find the proper search term to get any hits or any supplier even talking about thickness as a dimension worth noting. Am I the only one to every have this problem?

    [Protip] If you're buying a $25 halfshaft when the Genuine one costs $250...get 3. You're still saving money and the they are BOUND to be poorly machined. It will take at least 3 to get a good one. And save yourself the time. I'm learning...slowly.
    ...┌───────┬──,,
    ...|______OD__|__\\_____
    ...d ..__ ......... |... | ..__....p
    └/ | \────┴──┴/ | \─┘≡
    ..../..@........................@

    1973 Series 3, 109

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    162

    Default

    that is a ruff story, i'd be pretty perturbed, back in the day when i had to get a new one i ordered from atlantic british, i don't recall the price but they always fit. you have to have a pretty steady hand to get that down even after shaving that much off. at about .02'' thickness you may be somewhat hesitant about their holding together but .......... maybe get another to have on hand?
    I have the original factory manuals that were sent to dealerships. i think 90 wt. oil is fine unless you live in greenland or somewhere.
    good job on cutting that circlip down .01 + !

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2021
    Location
    SF Bay Area
    Posts
    97

    Default

    @jimr. Yeah the circlip thing was annoying, but I don't have a machine shop and I was at my end with the fit. It was so close. Protip, if you ever have to do something like that: Use a strong magnet to hold it! I had some cabinet latch magnet in my parts bins(hoarder bin ). The first one made my hand sore. After the magnet, I could hold onto something bigger and press down evenly. After that, it was short work!

    I started looking at dedicated c-clip suppliers, and yeah, they sell them in whatever thickness you want. If I was running a mechanic shop, yeah, I'd probably just order some in smaller increments and move on to another job. But these car part suppliers don't have that info in their computers, so you have to dig.

    I don't think it's too bad. I'm not set up for that accurate measurement at home...so take these numbers with a grain of salt. But the original ones are somewhere between 0.062 and 0.059...and I took them down to like 0.05 or 0.048. So they are like 1/6th thinner, in relative terms. They look identical to the eye. But it was enough to get them in and allowing the ujoint to move freely.

    The U-joint is a press-fit, with those clips just holding the lip from sliding. I think it will hold.

    As another point about these U-Joint circlips:
    I saw alot of people on forums talking about their c-clips having a chamfered or rounded side and a flat side. They went on endlessly about putting the chamfered side out...something about making them easier to install that way. I put some chamfers on mine (why not, I was grinding them anyway) and DO NOT DO THAT!! It made getting them in not much easier(because you drive the U-joint down past the slot anyway and flip over and drive it back). But, I noticed when I flipped the half-shaft over and drove it the other way(to give clearance for the opposite c-clip install). Boom! The c-clip had slipped!

    I can confirm that chamfered or rounding the outter c-clip surface just makes a "ramp" for the housing to ride against and gives it an easier way to slip out!! When I hit it with a brass hammer to center everything it slipped!!! Do not chamfer! Or if you get chamfered ones, throw them away!!

    A dead-flat c-clip has nowhere to go. After I took the chamfer off(I had to plane them down anyway for my project) I did the same "drive down, install c-clip, flip it over, drive down, install other c-clip, flip it, brass hammer while holding it, flip it, brass hammer while holding it to center" and it held solid!!

    That's my test. And, like you said - crap I got 2 extra half shafts now. So, I guess I have backups??
    ...┌───────┬──,,
    ...|______OD__|__\\_____
    ...d ..__ ......... |... | ..__....p
    └/ | \────┴──┴/ | \─┘≡
    ..../..@........................@

    1973 Series 3, 109

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2021
    Location
    SF Bay Area
    Posts
    97

    Default

    Another question for you guys, same project:

    I got new Swivel Ball to Axle bearings. LR part# 244150G...yes "(G)enuine this time!!
    And as I was assembling everything, I noticed the new bearings:
    1) have a removable inside race type thing(a machined cylinder).
    2) have PLASTIC spacers between the rollers!!!

    Check out the pictures. What do you folks think?!

    Hate to install plastic on my Axle rotating assembly!! WTF, I got "OEM" and "G" part number!!

    Also, the extra pieces is confusing. Check out the original on the left. The Axle has a couple race/spacer things...but they are chamfered or conical...not a flat collar? Is it just a packing thing? Like they are worried the rollers would fall out in shipping? So confused...

    [Edit] Okay, I feel silly. The "extra" part on the axle bearing was the race/collar that is pressed onto the Axle. I see it now. Still worried about the plastic roller retainer. Anyone have these fail before?
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    Last edited by vlad_d; 08-16-2021 at 03:05 AM.
    ...┌───────┬──,,
    ...|______OD__|__\\_____
    ...d ..__ ......... |... | ..__....p
    └/ | \────┴──┴/ | \─┘≡
    ..../..@........................@

    1973 Series 3, 109

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