Weird vibration

[Clive]

In the last 2-3 wks the truck has developed a vibration (more felt than heard, although a few bits of sheet metal rattle in tune) between about 30 and 45 mph. Could the rear drive shaft splines be worn? I checked it and could detect movement between the splines when I rotated the oppposite halves against each other - more movement than the front prop that is relatively unused (free-wheeling hubs). How can I check this without fancy equipment, and what else could it be before I go and buy a new drrive shaft? The CV joints seem to be fine...many thanks.

[fruitpunch]

Rattles.... first thing to do is engage 4wd and see if your rattle disappears.

Mine did last time I had this problem. Turned out to be rear prop shaft wear. You can also take out rear propshaft and see if you get and vibration while just driving in front wheel drive.

Any decent propshaft repair place can rebuilt these to better then original specs.

[J!m]

I agree- the splines sound like they are shot. I assume the u-joints are perfect if you went to the splines, but there should be virtuallu no movement up and down, and even less trying to counter-rotate the halves.

PS the free-wheel hubs only starve the front upper steering pin and u-joints of oil. Make sure you engage the hubs regularly to move that oil around.

I do not condone the use of free-wheel hubs, as they are a weak link prone to breakage and do not offer any substantial increase in fuel economy on a series truck. This is on top of the loss of splash-oil as mentioned earlier...

[landi41]

I do not condone the use of free-wheel hubs, as they are a weak link prone to breakage and do not offer any substantial increase in fuel economy on a series truck.

Surely an opinion Jim, i've only ever seen one Warn hub break... on the other hand i've seen front axels and spider gears explode with hubs engaged.....

This is on top of the loss of splash-oil as mentioned earlier...

On this we agree

[J!m]

It is your truck and your choice of course.

I have seen the ramins of too many hubs (and overdrives for that matter) to allow them on any major expedition for Drive the Globe. I always do the tech inspections prior to the major expeditions, and have the support of the company owner with this decision (based on his own misfortune). If you have locking hubs and/or an overdrive, they must be removed or the truck does not go; simple as that. We need absolute reliability on these trips and even without those weak links, there are plenty of other places to fail as you have pointed out. We went through two transmissions, two diffs and two locking hubs on the trip (on top of a bent front axle tube and two sets of rear springs and about a thousnad 'minor' failures). Let's not add fuel to the fire...

It's more than an opinion when based on hard data.

J!m

[Leslie]

I have seen the ramins of too many hubs (and overdrives for that matter) to allow them on any major expedition for Drive the Globe. I always do the tech inspections prior to the major expeditions, and have the support of the company owner with this decision (based on his own misfortune). If you have locking hubs and/or an overdrive, they must be removed or the truck does not go; simple as that. We need absolute reliability on these trips and even without those weak links, there are plenty of other places to fail as you have pointed out. We went through two transmissions, two diffs and two locking hubs on the trip (on top of a bent front axle tube and two sets of rear springs and about a thousnad 'minor' failures). Let's not add fuel to the fire...

It's more than an opinion when based on hard data.

Jim,
Of the two hubs that died, what brand were they? Faireys? Superwinch? AVM?

What problems have you had with overdrives? Strictly Faireys? Toros?

[J!m]

One set of hubs were definitely Warn brand; I don't recall the other. That Warn set had the most broken parts falling out of them... Actually, while on the subject of Warn, I can honestly say I have not seen any other brand of winch broken more often than Warn brand. They are very popular, but seem to be made quite poorly.

The overdrives from all manufactures (for the series) have problems and death at some point. If you buy it new, run full synthetic only and change the oil VERY often (every 1000 miles or more often if driven for long periods), and check the oil level daily, you should get 10 years out of them before they die. They all have small sumps, and run exceptionally hot. The problem is, no one wants to buy them new, and no one wants to change the oil. So, the bearings fry and/or seize. If they seize, they can take out transfer box parts with them, so just carrying along the old plate and bearing is not an option either.

Don't get me wrong, I like the idea of an overdrive, and am considering one for my 110 (the new one RN is offering); however it will be removed prior to any expedition, as it would be for any other participant of any Drive the Globe expedition.

When you vehicle is relied upon to get you, your rider and all the gear you carry safely home, it is not up for discussion...

[Leslie]

My '72 has dealer-installed Warns on it. I leave them locked, though... I'd only unlock them for a longer highway trip, then lock them back once off the highway. Even around town, they stay locked.

What problems have you seen with Wise Owl's Roverdrive?

I don't have an overdrive (yet), but have been considering a Roverdrive, not a Fairey (don't think you could find a Toro anymore, either).

[singingcamel]

i would have to say it sounds like u joints to me, the front one to be exact.
grease them to see if the noise quits, if it does you just made the diagnosis. marc

[Clive]

Just to make sure I am being logical here - do the free wheeling hubs disengage the front drive shafts and prop shaft (when in 2WD)? Therefore the CV joints in the front should be stationary when the FWHs are in FW mode, and no wear should occur, except perhaps to the upper pin of the swivel ball. So theoretically the front drive components should last longer with FW hubs installed? Or is there something about their operation I am not understanding? Thanks.

[J!m]

Nope, you got it.

So when the hub is disengaged (freewheeling) the upper pin and u-joint do not get proper oiling (even more so if the oil is low, or leaking out), so the bearings, u-joint and pin can go dry and run the high risk of rust forming through condensation.

[fruitpunch]

I couldn't agree move with Jim post. Free Wheeling hubs = bad idea, you save may be a few $$$ on gas but when you get stranded in the middle of no where without the correct parts to fix something, so useless what's the point. I guess the same holds true for the O/D unless you might be in a country like the Central African Republic where gas price is like 15 bucks a gallon and you think saving 10% makes sense. Might be true for a Carb V8 but I think the low tech approach is the way to go.

[n6zt]

I have the Roverdrive in my Dormobile; I have also seen the developmental work and serious testing that Ray has put into that unit. It is SO robust; much more so than most mechanical parts on a Rover. I believe that anyone would be satisfied with the reliability of this unit.

[landi41]

It's more than an opinion when based on hard data.

J!m

Your Expeditions your choice of equipment

I stand by what i said..... lock out hubs breaking in use is more uncommon than common and i've been on a few expeditions as well, with a number of lock out hub equiped Series Land Rovers, some with lock outs on all 4 axels, (for towing purposes) as i said previously i've only seen one fail and it was a Warn.......

I would suggest that any number of lock out hub equiped Series trucks need the hubs serviced ie: taken apart, cleaned and lubricated......the first hint of when this should be done is when you see someone getting out the vice grips to engage or dis-engage them........

anyway i've got bigger problems than broken lock out hubs these days...I've got a Discovery..

[Tim Smith]

We went through two transmissions, two diffs and two locking hubs on the trip (on top of a bent front axle tube and two sets of rear springs and about a thousnad 'minor' failures).

Oh my goodness!
Where was that expedition Jim? I can't imagine going through all that in one trip.