Knocking in 2.25

[I Leak Oil]

Until (or if) you get into it you might never know what has taken out the bearing. Mileage, lack of oil pressure, mechanical failure, perhaps your neighbor secretly drag raced it at high RPM's while you were sleeping....

I'm surprised you got advice in this thread to just run it and see what happens. Once a motor starts to knock it's too late and it's done, they never get better, only worse and that happens quickly in most cases.

There is a SIII motor on GnR for $550 right now in NY state....Might be worth the inquiry.

[NC_Mule]

Sorry to hear is was something major.
We don't know the exact cause of this failure but this is the first I've heard about over revving a 2.25. I feel like I rev mine a pretty good amount, mostly because it's a 2.25 4 cylinder and I remember revving the heck out of the 2.0 in my old Fiat Spider. Although that was a 5 brearing crank now that I think about it. What's the safe range for these engines? I have a tach I can install and see what range I have been driving in.
pb

[SafeAirOne]

Without re-reading this thread, I don't think that over-revving was involved. Just low oil pressure and increased wear on the consumable parts (and the non-consumable cylinder bores too). Normal engine rebuild stuff (aka "nothing lasts forever").

[I Leak Oil]

Without re-reading this thread, I don't think that over-revving was involved. Just low oil pressure and increased wear on the consumable parts (and the non-consumable cylinder bores too). Normal engine rebuild stuff (aka "nothing lasts forever").

That's probably a good guess and that's what I'd chalk it up to as well.

[Revtor]

Does anyone have any insight as to how well these 2.25's were balanced from the factory? Has anyone weighed their pistons/rods? One day i'll have mine out again for major work and it's something I would do..

edit
although reading the wikpedia article, inline 4's are inherently unbalanced due to the pistons moving faster at the up to down stroke vs the down to up stroke. Hence balancing shafts used in most modern 4's.. also the non overlapping power strokes. I guess perfect component balance wouldn't be of much smoothness benefit. id still do it though

anyway

[rbbailey]

The history of this engine is relatively unknown. I bought it after it had sat in a barn for 12 years. The original owner had given it to his best buddy when he died those twelve years before. He had driven the thing a lot, the motor is not original, but an import at some later date. (It has a plate on the side.)

When I bought it, it ran, and ran fairly well. I decided to take care of it, but to keep a hands off approach since it was running -- ain't broke, don't fix it. I sold the car, then bought it back. In that time, it got new ignition components, new fuel pump, and I believe it got the sump cleaned out -- at least, it's hard to believe how clean it was when I opened it up.

When I bought it back, it still ran well, but I didn't drive it long before shutting it down to take care of new break system, rust in... blah, blah.... In the course of that work I did the main seal, checked the sump, new water pump, etc...

Fast forward 2.5 years when I FINALLY get this work done and it starts and runs well... but then it is low oil pressure and ect... and here we are a few weeks later.

All of this to say that I do think this is normal wear that was simply pushed over the edge when the engine sat for 2.5 years.

Also, I would like some input on the following:
1. Could worn bearings be the CAUSE of the oil pressure problem?
2. A mechanic told me NOT to bring it in to him before doing what he would do to his car first (since it's very likely a full rebuild anyway) since it seemed to run well, why not change the bearings that can be changed from below the engine first? He told me how he's done it without removing the engine. And he told me how I can test the wear on the shaft. His view is that it *might* work. At least, the $150 bucks for a set of bearings that might do the trick is better than jumping off the bridge for several thousands worth of a rebuild or a mod to a diesel.

[SafeAirOne]

1. Could worn bearings be the CAUSE of the oil pressure problem?
2. A mechanic told me NOT to bring it in to him before doing what he would do to his car first (since it's very likely a full rebuild anyway) since it seemed to run well, why not change the bearings that can be changed from below the engine first? He told me how he's done it without removing the engine. And he told me how I can test the wear on the shaft. His view is that it *might* work. At least, the $150 bucks for a set of bearings that might do the trick is better than jumping off the bridge for several thousands worth of a rebuild or a mod to a diesel.

1) Tricky question. Wear could cause low oil pressure because there will be no backpressure in the lubrication system due to the enormous gaps between the parts, but the cause of the wear could be (but doesn't HAVE to be) an oil supply problem like a worn pump. How's that for a foggy answer?

2)You could just change all the main and rod bearings and thrust bearings pretty easily, and probably prolong a rebuild for a while (presuming the oil pump is up to snuff), but looking at the amount of wear there, it's probably safe to presume that all the other components that rely on the lubricating system and some that indirectly rely on it are similarly worn when you get to the stage that you can hear audible knocking in the main and rod bearings.

You can just about count on the cam bearings and rocker bearings being in a similar state along with pretty loose pistons, I'd guess. Just depends on how much time and money you have to spend on it at the moment, but know that just replacing the main and rod bearings probably is a short term solution. This could mean 'months' or 'years'. Who knows.

[rbbailey]

OK, so I've made my decision on what to do. I think there is too much scoring on the main shaft to make it worth putting bearings in just to see if it works. The low oil pressure may not be solved by putting new bearings in.

I could put a 200Tdi in, but.... could and should are very different. I just don't have the money to do it without really biting the bullet, and then what? What condition engine would it be anyway? To get one that was really good, I would be spending close to $10k when all is said and done.

So I am going to get a 2.25 in running condition. I'll take all my good parts (lots of "new" stuff on this engine) and swap it out. I will keep the old block and slowly restore it so that when the engine in the truck is done, I simply swap. I could go through quite a few swaps, many miles, before matching the cost of a conversion. And conversions are great, but they always have their own set of problems. Besides, if I'm going to get a Tdi Rover, I think I would rather build a D110 from parts than to hack what is essentially a stock 1965 IIa.

Thanks for all the help and info.

Anyone have an engine for sale?

[SafeAirOne]

Speaking personally, I think you've made the wrong decision.--Unless you just want to put a $500 engine in and roll the dice, that is.

Can I ask you why you'd seek ANOTHER USED ENGINE when your's only needs a fairly-routine, $1200 rebuild?

There's nothing special about scored journals on the crankshaft--Machine shops deal with these a half dozen times a week.; All they do is polish/machine them down to a particular size so you can fit commonly-available oversize bearings.

I urge you to talk to your local machine shop BEFORE you buy an unknown used engine. Yours is still a potentially good engine, unless you know something we don't..

[rbbailey]

Actually, that is pretty much what im doing. I will have the engine rebuilt on my own time -- out of the car -- with my own hands. I have a running engine from a trusted source that I can get for $700 (no shipping cost). It isn't new, but the owner drove it regularly before simply deciding he needed a Chevy in-line put in. I will swap my new parts onto it, have a running truck while im rebuilding an engine on a stand in the garage. In the end, I would at least have a backup engine for parts or to simply swap when the time comes.

Also, the bearing and shaft rebuild is a roll of the dice on whether it will fix the oil pressure issue. I think that a complete teardown is needed, but it will take me a year to complete.

You could simply say I've decided to keep it stock and I'm buying an engine to get me on the road since the car has been in my garage for 2.5 years and my kids are getting older and I simply want to drive.

[SafeAirOne]

Ahh...OK, got it.

That's exactly what I've got going on right now...a temporary engine while my primary engine (eventually) gets fixed.