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Hello Everyone!
I’m in need of some serious help in regard to the differential pinion oil seal and such.
So many weird questions have popped up but I’ll try to keep them as few as possible. I’m in no way shape or form a mechanic so please bear with me as I try to explain the issues/problems.
The Rover in question is a 1963 SIIa 88.
Vehicle serial # 24406929A
Engine serial # 25140728C
Gearbox serial # 2514664B
The Green Bible’s parts book says that the differential style is for the front and rear Rover axles suffix A-G. That's plain and simple and easy to understand.
Question #1 –
There are some parts within the differential that are different based on the suffix. For example, if you need to replace the differential pinion inner bearing you order one number for suffix "A" and another for suffix "B" onwards. Since the differential is part of the drive train it would make sense, at least to me, that you use the suffix code associated with the gearbox - in my case that would be "B". Is this correct?
Currently I'm working on the swivel balls and hubs but am waiting for some parts to arrive before finishing them. I figured I could go ahead and get started on replacing the oil seals and such on the differentials. When the rear differential end plate/oil seal retainer/mud shield assy unit (part #236547) came off, the pinion inner bearing came off with it.
Attached to the outer side of the bearing (the end facing the drive shaft) was a washer. This washer has two different designations; thrust washer (part #231242 suffix “A”) or differential Spacer (part # 539745 suffix “B” onwards). Attached to the inner facing side of the bearing were the remains of various sized shims. Several of the shims are so worn there are even holes in them and some of the shims disintegrated into pieces. Some of these pieces are so thin they become almost invisible when you look at them from the side! The stack of shims is somewhere between 1/8 - 1/4 inches tall and there are 7 in various shapes of “intact” and 2 or 3 in pieces.
Question #2 –
Is it possible to buy a set of assorted shims like you can for the swivel ball Railko? All I'm finding are individual shims from a couple of suppliers and the prices are around $1.30 - $7.95 for each shim and one of them is even $19.00! It seems like someone would sell a set since you have to play with the pinion in order to figure out how many you need like; just like you have to do with the Railko ones.
Question #3, #4 & #4a –
In regard to the pinion shims… The manual talks about a "pre-load" of 7-12 pounds in regard to the pinion and the shims. Was there a part that created the "pre-load"? There is a part in the exploded parts view in the parts book; it’s listed as 502248 suffix "A" NLS (it could be 602248 - smudged printing), was this the "pre-load" part? If so, it could still be attached to that stack of washers - there appears to be a thicker one on them.
The following photo shows how the parts off my Rover match the post "Suffix A" diagram. However, I'm wondering if the shim closest to the differential planetary gears (the biggest shim) is actually the missing mystery shim 502248 suffix "A".
There was a metal clad oil seal inside the differential end plate/oil seal retainer/mud shield assy unit with "275124" stamped on it. I could not find that number associated with LR but I did one with Volvo. The original part number for the seal is 217507 but the replacement is FRC4586. The replacement part looks nothing like the original and isn't as thick either. It appears that the thrust washer/differential spacer rides up against the oil seal. Since the original oil seal is covered with metal it appears that the thrust washer/differential spacer didn’t damage the seal. This leads me to my next question.
Question #5 & #6 –
The new seal is covered in rubber and the lip end faces the pinion inner bearing and the thrust washer/differential spacer would be shoved up against it. Since the lip end is the hollow end, and it’s made of rubber, what keeps the thrust washer/differential spacer from chewing the new oil seal up? Is there a better oil seal I should be looking at? I haven’t found a metal clad oil seal available for my differential type. AB has one that looks to be the same size as the metal clad one but it is also covered in rubber - Item: 65 (Same Fit As Part # FRC4586 )
Question #7 & #8 –
As to that thrust washer/differential spacer…the one that came out with the bearing is a little thicker than a quarter. The replacement part for “suffix A” is 231242 and I haven’t been able to find a picture of it. The one for “suffix B onwards” is 539745 and is a LOT thicker. This is one of the reasons I asked about the suffixes at the beginning. Which part should be used? If part #539745 is the correct one how will the extra length/thickness affect the pinion and all the other parts on it? Something of note - John Craddock Ltd says the part didn't start to be used until 1965.
So – can any of you help shed some light on these things?
Thanks for all of the help!
I’m in need of some serious help in regard to the differential pinion oil seal and such.
So many weird questions have popped up but I’ll try to keep them as few as possible. I’m in no way shape or form a mechanic so please bear with me as I try to explain the issues/problems.
The Rover in question is a 1963 SIIa 88.
Vehicle serial # 24406929A
Engine serial # 25140728C
Gearbox serial # 2514664B
The Green Bible’s parts book says that the differential style is for the front and rear Rover axles suffix A-G. That's plain and simple and easy to understand.
Question #1 –
There are some parts within the differential that are different based on the suffix. For example, if you need to replace the differential pinion inner bearing you order one number for suffix "A" and another for suffix "B" onwards. Since the differential is part of the drive train it would make sense, at least to me, that you use the suffix code associated with the gearbox - in my case that would be "B". Is this correct?
Currently I'm working on the swivel balls and hubs but am waiting for some parts to arrive before finishing them. I figured I could go ahead and get started on replacing the oil seals and such on the differentials. When the rear differential end plate/oil seal retainer/mud shield assy unit (part #236547) came off, the pinion inner bearing came off with it.
Attached to the outer side of the bearing (the end facing the drive shaft) was a washer. This washer has two different designations; thrust washer (part #231242 suffix “A”) or differential Spacer (part # 539745 suffix “B” onwards). Attached to the inner facing side of the bearing were the remains of various sized shims. Several of the shims are so worn there are even holes in them and some of the shims disintegrated into pieces. Some of these pieces are so thin they become almost invisible when you look at them from the side! The stack of shims is somewhere between 1/8 - 1/4 inches tall and there are 7 in various shapes of “intact” and 2 or 3 in pieces.
Question #2 –
Is it possible to buy a set of assorted shims like you can for the swivel ball Railko? All I'm finding are individual shims from a couple of suppliers and the prices are around $1.30 - $7.95 for each shim and one of them is even $19.00! It seems like someone would sell a set since you have to play with the pinion in order to figure out how many you need like; just like you have to do with the Railko ones.
Question #3, #4 & #4a –
In regard to the pinion shims… The manual talks about a "pre-load" of 7-12 pounds in regard to the pinion and the shims. Was there a part that created the "pre-load"? There is a part in the exploded parts view in the parts book; it’s listed as 502248 suffix "A" NLS (it could be 602248 - smudged printing), was this the "pre-load" part? If so, it could still be attached to that stack of washers - there appears to be a thicker one on them.
The following photo shows how the parts off my Rover match the post "Suffix A" diagram. However, I'm wondering if the shim closest to the differential planetary gears (the biggest shim) is actually the missing mystery shim 502248 suffix "A".
There was a metal clad oil seal inside the differential end plate/oil seal retainer/mud shield assy unit with "275124" stamped on it. I could not find that number associated with LR but I did one with Volvo. The original part number for the seal is 217507 but the replacement is FRC4586. The replacement part looks nothing like the original and isn't as thick either. It appears that the thrust washer/differential spacer rides up against the oil seal. Since the original oil seal is covered with metal it appears that the thrust washer/differential spacer didn’t damage the seal. This leads me to my next question.
Question #5 & #6 –
The new seal is covered in rubber and the lip end faces the pinion inner bearing and the thrust washer/differential spacer would be shoved up against it. Since the lip end is the hollow end, and it’s made of rubber, what keeps the thrust washer/differential spacer from chewing the new oil seal up? Is there a better oil seal I should be looking at? I haven’t found a metal clad oil seal available for my differential type. AB has one that looks to be the same size as the metal clad one but it is also covered in rubber - Item: 65 (Same Fit As Part # FRC4586 )
Question #7 & #8 –
As to that thrust washer/differential spacer…the one that came out with the bearing is a little thicker than a quarter. The replacement part for “suffix A” is 231242 and I haven’t been able to find a picture of it. The one for “suffix B onwards” is 539745 and is a LOT thicker. This is one of the reasons I asked about the suffixes at the beginning. Which part should be used? If part #539745 is the correct one how will the extra length/thickness affect the pinion and all the other parts on it? Something of note - John Craddock Ltd says the part didn't start to be used until 1965.
So – can any of you help shed some light on these things?
Thanks for all of the help!
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