Winter Oil

[willincalgary]

The weather has turned cold up here in Calgary. Today was -18C (0'ish for you imperial types) and I've noticed at these low temperatures my oil pressure is taking longer to climb up to the values I'm used to. Typically get 50psi at idle within 3-4 seconds but now it is taking 10. I'm wondering if people generally run the same oil year round or switch to something somewhat thinner in the winter? Perhaps synthetic?

[ybt502r]

I spent several recent winters in Calgary with my SIII. I used synthetic 10w-40 in the engine exclusively and a mixture of synthetic and petroleum-based 90w in the drivetrain. I don't recall ever having oil pressure issues even down to -30C, but if you have petroleum-based engine oil, then it could be due to your pump straining to pump molasses until things get warm, which can take a good while.

I found that a radiator muff and an radiator hose heater (both from our hosts) were essential to getting the engine warm and keeping it there. I only had the stock heater, and so I mostly drove around in a very cold truck, but it would put out enough heat to keep the windows clear and maybe my feet warm (off the transmission mostly I think).

The synthetic in the engine really made a difference, as it never failed to start and was easy to crank. I found (no science but experience) that straight synthetic in the gear box was not good as it didn't seem to provide enough lubrication - like the oil was too thin. Straight petroleum-base 90w was too thick (experience again) at -20C, and I ended up with about 2/3's petroleum-based oil and 1/3 synthetic. Everything seemed to run well at that mixture. I did put mostly synthetic in the differentials, and I never had issues with that.

I'm now in Indonesia (the truck is in Port Townsend, WA, with my son), so your story gives me nostalgia. I loved Calagary. Could have used another Series owner there. I did find a very good British mechanic there if you need one.

[TedW]

Hi Will:

I agree with the comments above regarding synthetic motor oil; my experience with it in numerous sub-zero F Maine winters (it gets really cold over here) bears this out.

Synthetic stays fluid when it gets really cold and pumps quickly at start-up. It also just lubricates better than dino juice does.

However, I strongly disagree with the above comments on synthetic gear oil not lubricating as well as traditional gear oil. All the data I have read points to the opposite conclusion. Synthetic lubricants are considered superior to traditional oils in every category except price.

I am not providing any data to back this up; it is readily available on various web sites.

I did do a cold-weather test one night: I left a bottle of traditional gear lube and a bottle of Amsoil gear lube outside overnight. The next morning it was -30F. The traditional gear lube squeezed out of the bottle like rubber cement, and the Amsoil showed no sign of thickening at all. Needless to say, I saw a huge improvement in performance when I switched to synthetic.

This is just my opinion - others may have come to different conclusions.

Ted

[willincalgary]

Thanks

I think I've got enough data points now to swap to synthetic. Temperature fell to -21C (-6F) this morning and the truck would not start because the starter would barely turn the engine over. I think I'm glad it did not start I can't imagine the wear it might have suffered before the oil pressure came up. I'll use the Honda sitting in the heated garage and swap the Rover to synthetic when it warms up a bit.

[TedW]

Hi Will:

The link below will take you to a gear lube study conducted by Amsoil - yes, they have an axe to grind on this subject, but the data is quite conclusive, in my view. And other synthetic brands besides Amsoil perform well - according to the data.

Very "wonkish," but right up our alley.

Ted

http://www.synthetic-oil-tech.com/Gear%20Lube%20White%20Paper.pdf

[LaneRover]

I think I've got enough data points now to swap to synthetic. Temperature fell to -21C (-6F) this morning and the truck would not start because the starter would barely turn the engine over. I think I'm glad it did not start I can't imagine the wear it might have suffered before the oil pressure came up. I'll use the Honda sitting in the heated garage and swap the Rover to synthetic when it warms up a bit.

If you have a big ol cast iron frying pan put a bunch of charcoal in it, light it and then let the flames die down so that you just have the nice red and white coals burning. Then slip the pan under the oil pan. Leave it for 15-20 minutes and then start it. I've used this method a few times to start a Rover that seems to be longing for the warmer weather.

It works best if it isn't too breezy and there aren't gas leaks!

[ybt502r]

Re the synthetic 90w, I don't dispute its superior lubrication - I work in the oil business and I know a bit about that stuff. My comments relate to the design and operation of a Series gear box. There are other recommendations and comments in this forum that address this. I went to full synthetic in the gear box from the background that it's just better, period. But from performance (and leaks) and subsequent repairs, I have arrived at a view (and it's not unique) that petroleum 90w is better for the gear box and transfer. You can find technical justification in this forum about that. However, as I still needed to drive in Calgary, I found that a mixture of synthetic and petroleum 90w seemed to give me the benefits of both.

[JimCT]

Red Line shock proof

Switching to red line shock proof synthetic gear oil has been one of the best things i have done to the ambulance. Shifts easier, runs quieter and is not bound up when it is below zero

[artpeck]

Switching to red line shock proof synthetic gear oil has been one of the best things i have done to the ambulance. Shifts easier, runs quieter and is not bound up when it is below zero

I would second the above. Was surprised at the difference it made when I switched. And it is supposedly by formulation kind to the structure and metals of a series gear box.

As to cold we were all bundled up here in Nor Cal today as the temperature dipped all the way down to 50...

[bpj911]

MTL

you should probably use something designed for transmissions with syncros otherwise it's so slippery they don't work well. Lots of clashing, etc unless you use MTL or MT90 in the transmission. I'd think anything is fine in the tcase

[bpj911]

winter oil

I use regular engine oil in my transmission and it shifts a lot easier in the winter. 5w30. It only gets down to -30F or so here at the worst. I generally use straight 30W in the transmission in the summer. Regular 80W90 in everything else though i used shockproof redline in the overdrive

I use 5W40 synthetic in the diesel though and it's a noticeable improvement over the 15W40 i run in the summer.

[willincalgary]

I feel for you. 50 degrees in November must be tough.

I would second the above. Was surprised at the difference it made when I switched. And it is supposedly by formulation kind to the structure and metals of a series gear box.

As to cold we were all bundled up here in Nor Cal today as the temperature dipped all the way down to 50...

[Skookumchuck]

I put a magnetic heater on the oil pan and plug it in. The red Rover starts up fine with this. I am in the East Kootenays and so far this winter this has worked great for me. -24 lastnight

[SafeAirOne]

you should probably use something designed for transmissions with syncros otherwise it's so slippery they don't work well. Lots of clashing, etc unless you use MTL or MT90 in the transmission. I'd think anything is fine in the tcase

I concur. I thought it'd be nifty to use Mobil1 synthetic gear oil in my brand new virgin rebuilt transmission and transfer case several years ago. The synchros didn't like it.

[TedW]

Re the synthetic 90w, I don't dispute its superior lubrication - I work in the oil business and I know a bit about that stuff. My comments relate to the design and operation of a Series gear box. There are other recommendations and comments in this forum that address this. I went to full synthetic in the gear box from the background that it's just better, period. But from performance (and leaks) and subsequent repairs, I have arrived at a view (and it's not unique) that petroleum 90w is better for the gear box and transfer. You can find technical justification in this forum about that. However, as I still needed to drive in Calgary, I found that a mixture of synthetic and petroleum 90w seemed to give me the benefits of both.

YBT: I appreciate your comments and your observations on this subject. I am merely an end-user with an interest in the subject but with no professional expertise.

The subject of synthetic gear lube and its impact on syncro performance has come up on this forum fairly often. The issue seems (IIRC) to be mostly an issue with SIII gearboxes. I run synth in my IIA box and have had no issues in the 20 years I have owned the truck. Perhaps the syncros for 3rd and 4th gears are less susceptible to the problem?