dead truck

[vintage]

Heard this one before? 1994 RRC, started 100% of the time last 10 years use of this second owner truck. Drove through a puddle Saturday. After that truck was dead. Nothing when turn key. No cranking, no dash lights, no power to windows, no can switch out of park...nothing. Electrical silence. However, dome light works, as do door locks. Flummoxed in Philly.

THX if any ideas.

[spacemutt]

How deep was the puddle? Sounds like a dead main ecu to me.

[vintage]

puddle killed truck

...the puddle was trivial, couple inches deep, hit it at 20 - 25 mph. Truck continued to run until I shut it off. One observation I did not mention: before complete electrical silence the dash lights did light up for a few seconds on first and second attempt to start. By the third attempt, all power associated with turning the key in the ignition was gone.

[dieselrangerover]

maybe a bad ground... seems like i'm constantly chasing grounding issues

[AndrewG]

There's two metal relays in the passanger footwell or under the passanger seat depending on the year. These are the main relays, I'd start with checking power to these.

[joshua.mcguoirk]

Coincidence?

Check the battery.

How much voltage does it have while parked?
How much voltage does it have while attempting to start?

Sounds like a coincidence.

[spacemutt]

Might not be a coincidence. The water could have caused the belts to slip and not charge the battery.

[vintage]

battery is OK

Just checked the battery. 12V at rest and 12V when ignition key turned. No change in voltage. Also, no brake light when push brake. Maybe its a problem with the ignition switch...will need to thoroughly check the ground connections. As far as that goes, I am guessing I should look for loose, rusted connections where contacts would be failing. Honestly, that just does not seem like the problem since never had a hint of a problem before.

In the spirit of transparency and full disclosure....the radiator has been leaking for several months, spraying some coolant on engine, but not excessive. And, as indicted truck has been working 100%. However, the way the problem surfaced - ie immediate, absolute failure - it seems to me like something broke...

I hope this is not a red herring. I will be under the truck early Sat AM.

Thanks for suggestions already and any more words.

[joshua.mcguoirk]

Jump starter

Battery should be around 12.5V at rest.
May dip down to ~10V while attempting to start.

To test the ignition switch... turn the key to the on position (II?)
Get under the vehicle and jump the starter by using a remote starter switch or by attaching a cable from the positive terminal on the starter to the bendix terminal. Does engine attempt to start? Or nothing?

I too live in Philly and may be available to render assistance.

[phoenix]

check all wiring related to battery and starter, seems to me you lost a major power or ground wire.
perform a voltage drop test...

[vintage]

all connections good, truck dead and 101F underneath

Thanks to all for suggestions. I have looked for and checked all the electrical connections and cannot find any apparent de-grounding problems. I have tried jumping it from my other car - to no avail - truck is dead. There is NOTHING electrical that works. Can turn the key - but the electric windows do not work, headlights do not work, turn signals do not work, brake lights do not work, headlights do not work. Oddly, the interior light works, the light under hood works, and the power lock mechanism works. But only those three things work!

After 45 min under the truck this afternoon - at 101F - I was actually putting together the words to sell this truck....and rationalizing a price. But then I thought of a recent design and performance off road perspective I read in a British car magazine (last night) - and came to my senses... Cannot sell this - need to FIX IT. Frustration building. The magnitude and breadth of the electrical death is telling me something...just not sure what it is though.

[ccec]

I Feel Your Pain !

Hang in there Vintage!

This one is def. a Ghost-in-the-machine job.

I'd say crawl under and look to see WHAT could have gotten wet with the puddle episode.

After that, look towards ALL the electrical connections that are affected by water into the floorboards. There's all those relays in those two kick panels and moisture LOVES to hang out there.

Other that that, this is a possibly a major ECU dealie, but not convinced yet. The ECU is so far away from the possibility of a puddle-crossing affecting your Rangie that it has to be something else... perhaps a wire leading to the ECU is being affected/crimped ???

Please keep us updated. I once had a non-start issue that was traced back to a bad coil ground.

--ccec

[ccec]

Shop Manual Says...

Vintage,

After my "posting the obvious" last night, I broke out my shop manual this morning.

This is the three-inch thick book that covers 1990 - 1994 RRC's... but, oddly enough, the wiring diagrams are only presented for 1990 and 1991 model years. Other years are found in a separate pub...

ANYWAY, what I found is that you should check these items:

1. The actual positive terminal post on top of the battery, There are a cluster of fat wires that lead to various places. Of course, remove and clean the actual post and connection. Maybe your radiator has been spewing fluid onto this terminal and the connection has been compromised. Same with the negative post, clean and scrub.

2. Nothing will light up if the "Ignition Load Relay" is toasted. According to my book, this is located under the dash, on the steering column. What's also involved, though, is fuse A-8, and the LH stop lamp (again, according to the book). So check those.

3. While your at it, check ALL the fuses in the fuse panel, on the lower dash, passenger side.

4. There should be a big wire leading from the battery to the positive side of the starter solenoid. Might as well trace it, and make sure it's not messed up.

Good Luck,

ccec

[MJL]

You have probably blown one or more of the fusible links. If you follow the wires from the +ve battery terminal you will find they go into what looks like a canvasy covered loom that runs along the top of the RH inner wing (fender). If you peel this all back you will see that the wires have fusible links in them - one or more of these has probably corroded over time nad finally blew.

I've owned 2 1994 RR's and thsi has happened to both of them.

Mike

[leadoff]

Battery should be around 12.5V at rest.
May dip down to ~10V while attempting to start.

To test the ignition switch... turn the key to the on position (II?)
Get under the vehicle and jump the starter by using a remote starter switch or by attaching a cable from the positive terminal on the starter to the bendix terminal. Does engine attempt to start? Or nothing?

I too live in Philly and may be available to render assistance.

----

Joshua -- thanks for this tip, though I don't know which is the Bendix terminal. My '90 RR County's starter motor is engaging intermittently (fun, huh?) and I'm trying to locate the problem. Seems like the switch... more ideas? Thx from TJ