suddenly no electric power at the dash

[NickDawson]

I'm having one of those days...
It started our great - sunny, planned to spend some time with the rover outside... all was bliss. In fact, I got a lot done. I adjusted the timing to help my idle issue, I wired up the work lamp in the rear, and I even wired up the rear window defogger (yeah, one of many additions from the PO). So I've got the dash pulled out and the side (where the heat controls are) opened. Lots wires!

Thats where things turn a turn for the worse. Everything was fine, I had the work lamp on for about 10 minutes and thought, might as well start 'er up for a while to get some current flowing. I noticed the temp gauge was reading cold and wanted to see if my timing adjustments effected a cold start.

I noticed the red charge light was on (this is important), hopped in and went to turn the key - nothing. No charge light, no power, nothing.

In fact, everything in the dash is dead. I have a switch that controls an electric radiator fan - its not keyed (on the ignition switch) and will run without the key in the truck, the fan wont work.

I'm sure its not the battery, its still putting out 12v and things that are not part of the dash, IE the work light which is wired to a fuse block under the hood, are working fine.

I checked all the fuses I could find - under the steering wheel and on the block mounted on top of the clutch master under the hood. One under the hood was burnt out, but here's the kicker, it didn't have a positive lead to it anyway. I'm guessing it had been burnt out for some time, part of a previous mission. It was a 25 amp and I thew in a 35amp (all I had) to make sure.

So what on earth could I have done to kill almost the entire electrical system? I checked the leads to the ignition - can't really reach them but could see that they were still attached.

[fishguy]

did you knock the primary hot lead off the post for the fuse box?

[Jeff Aronson]

I checked the leads to the ignition - can't really reach them but could see that they were still attached.

Nick,

I'm not certain what you mean by this line. Do you mean that all the wire connections at the switch look ok, that none got pulled out when you moved the dash panel? Your key is on the side of the steering column, right?

When you said the red alternator light was glowing, do you mean before you turned on the key? If so, then you crossed a circuit when you installed that work light or the rear defroster. Power should not "excite" the alternator until that circuit is completed by turning on the key.

If what you mean is that you turned the key, the red light and green light [oil pressure] go on, but the starter does not turn, or even click, then check your battery by testing it when the key is turned. If there's no change from the +-12v reading, then the problem might be in the starter.

I'd start by disconnecting the wires to the work light and the rear defroster, one at a time, and see if that makes a difference. You usually try and work back from the last thing you did.

Good luck,

Jeff

[NickDawson]

I checked the leads to the ignition - can't really reach them but could see that they were still attached.
not certain what you mean by this line.
When you said the red alternator light was glowing, do you mean before you turned on the key?


I'd start by disconnecting the wires to the work light and the rear defroster,

Good clarifying questions Jeff!

Prior to getting into the truck, the key was in the on position, the red charging light was on.... as in one more turn and it would engage the starter, which was my intent in hopping into the truck.

Once in the seat, when I went to turn the key, everything was dead. I cannot get the red or green lights on in any position. The battery is outputting 12V.

The ignition is on the left of the wheel - its a RHD.

I immediately un-did everything I had done today - no effect.

did you knock the primary hot lead off the post for the fuse box?

Fishguy - that was my thought and "feels right" but wasnt even sure if there was such a primary hot lead. I'm looking at the wiring diagram in the green bible but honestly its such a rats nest in there that I'm not sure I can decipher what is factory and what is someone's handy work.

Locating that hot lead is my primary mission at this point - so to clarify, is there one single hot lead that comes in from the other side of the firewall? If thats the case, it is the most likely culprit

[NickDawson]

Jeff and Fishguy - thank you gents!
That was the ticket! I found the primary hot lead via the wiring diagram, and sure enough, thats the one that was disconnected. There are about 20 wires onto that fuse block and it was back up in there and the insulation was still over the shovel/spade connector making it look connected.

At some point I owe everyone on this board a few cold ones for getting me out of these weekend warrior jams.Thanks again!!!

It doesnt appear that adjusting the timing to a slower idle has helped the dieseling though.... back to the drawing board on that one (and another thread)

Of course, now that its running I can go rent that arc welder I've been thinking about all weekend to fix my wrought iron railing. Listen, if I don't post again in a while, you all can divide my rover for parts amongst yourselves

[Jeff Aronson]

Good for you, Nick, for perservering and discovering the problem!

Retarding the timing is a common solution for dieseling, but not the only one. A high idle will cause the same problem; try lowering the idle at the carb to see what happens.

Dieseling is caused by a hot spot in the engine still igniting fuel after you've shut off the ignition. You could have a carbon buildup inside the head - not uncommon - that you won't get to until you remove the head one day. There are products sold at auto shops to burn off deposits in the cylinders; they're worth a try.

In the meantime, try running a higher octane gas. Right from the beginnning, my engine would diesel on regular gas; I need to run middle grade or higher to prevent it. Gas with today's ethanol has a different chemical composition than fuel when our Rovers were made.

Jeff

[brucejohn]

It doesnt appear that adjusting the timing to a slower idle has helped the dieseling though.... back to the drawing board on that one (and another thread)

Nick you may want to check the 'Advance/Retard question thread'. Scott and Travis gave great suggestions and a link that helped me tune my 82 Series III RHD 109 (by the way I think I bought a different 109 from that guy in Waxahachie Texas you mentioned in your search).

[fishguy]

Jeff and Fishguy - thank you gents!
That was the ticket!

It doesnt appear that adjusting the timing to a slower idle has helped the dieseling though.... back to the drawing board on that one (and another thread)

You're welcome, I knocked that one off a few times getting in and out of the dash.

My rover always dieseled on the "cheep" gas it likes premium...I'll have to sort that out once she's back on the road as gas has gone up a bit in the 2 years she has sat idle.

[jgkmmoore]

Buy a can of 'OMC ENGINE TUNE' at your fave Evinrude/Johnson dealer. Use it like the directions say, exactly. Will clean that carbon and residue right out....slick up your combustion chamber and piston top. It WILL smoke the neighborhood when you start up again after heat sinking it. Drive it HARD for a few minutes to get it well cleaned. High RPM for 10-15 seconds, and load the engine on hills for a bit. Great stuff. You'll feel like you picked up 10hp! Engine will run much smoother.
Regards-Jeff